Can you believe it’s only been three episodes?! Join us as we discuss the episode “The End is the Beginning”. How long have Zhaban and Laris been John Wick fans? What’s it say about someone who makes their EMH’s look like themselves? Were we the only ones who squealed like a little girl when Picard said engage?? Join us as we answer those questions and more!
Can you believe it’s only been three episodes?! Join us as we discuss the episode “The End is the Beginning”. How long have Zhaban and Laris been John Wick fans? What’s it say about someone who makes their EMH’s look like themselves? Were we the only ones who squealed like a little girl when Picard said engage?? Join us as we answer those questions and more!
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welcome to therefore host is always there are four hosts. I'm Sabrina. You can find me on Twitter, Twitter and Instagram and avoid cat gaming. And I'm very happy to tell you that one of us is back. J Thank
you very much. Hey, this is that. That's just average day on all socials. I apologize for missing the last couple episodes. I had a bit of a medical thing going on, And, uh, as you can hear, my voice still isn't 100% but I couldn't wait to come back to the podcast. So thank you very much for having me back.
And we could not wait to have you back. Believe me,
we're very excited. You're back, and I'm Michael. You can find me at Blue Beetle games, all right? Oh, yeah. And
then I'm Keith. Uh, usually, like the host says and live like a It is my bad. I'm Keith. You can find me on Twitter at keep Hayward
already is, though a CZ. You guys could tell from the intro, and I'm in charge of this episode again. So, uh, so sorry, everyone Here we are. So let's start. Keith, I know you wanted to do, like bad first and then good and then, like, mixed feelings. But I actually kind of want to try my own things. That's good with you. We're gonna talk about specific parts of the episode instead, so we can kind of, like, makes all the good and bad together. But before we do that, overall impressions, huh? Michael?
Ah, I liked it a lot. Of course, that's probably surprised you guys, but, uh, I like that. I'm surprised. It's only been three episodes in it seems like we've had a lot more. They crammed a lot into three episodes, so I enjoyed it overall.
Yeah, sure. Big J. How do you feel?
Uh, overall actually really liked the show. Um, I'm really excited. It's going. Yeah. I'm really excited to see where it's going. Excuse me. I will admit
that the stuff.
Yeah. Yes, I will admit that this episode was my least favorite episode three. Um, which we could get into, um, later.
Okay. Yeah, we I'm sure we'll cover it. Q.
Um, I actually like this episode. This is my favorite of the three. Yeah, I'm I'm still like, not sure how I am about the full show. But it's more of like a thing that maybe less frustrated about Star Wars, where you go to yourself, you look at it and you know yourself, this isn't Star Wars. It's not. You let it go like all these things that don't make sense is because it's not what you remember. Showers wasn't for this. Like, I'd be very upset with a lot of things. But it's timeto I have to like, because like they're completely normally not trying to do start tracked the way I liked it, and what they're doing now would start to kind of being Firefly e. All right, go for what? You guys want to try and calico of what I want and try to get with this And, like I did kind of enjoy the interact between characters, the build ups and the overall feel of this kind of Star Trek.
Yeah, I definitely agree with you there. I think it's gonna be troubling for me to continue trying to watch Star Trek Picard without thinking of it. That's kind of like an alternate universe, because so many of the things that were intrinsic to Star Trek for me, like the things that weren't true. Sick to Star Wars for you are not resident so much in this series again. I understand why they're doing it because they're trying to reflect the like, What happened to my country? That school in America are kind of feeling right now, but, um, what happens my Star Trek? You know. So, um, I'm gonna try going forward to consider Star Trek. The card is being kind of like an alternate universe Nemesis style Picard rather than teen Jeep the card. Uh, we'll see how that affects my feelings in the future, but ah, excellent. All right, so let's talk about the episode. Specifics s o. The episodes started once again with, um, the thing that happened on Mars and then transition into the 14 years ago reaction of the then Admiral Picard. Before we say anything else about the scene, I just want a compliment. Once again, the uniformed Division I I honestly like these 14 years ago, even more than the current ones. Like back shot was cordial.
Eso uniform, different
team. You were doing great job
selling gold band little band on Picard's uniform.
All right, that being said, I feel that We've had three episodes and all three episodes have started with the Mars thing. First with the cards, like dream of it, then with what actually happened. And then again with what happened. I didn't mind in the 1st 2 episodes because it was like Picard's version versus the real version. But this third version didn't give us any new information. And I'm just kind of done with starting every so the same way do you feel about it?
I think they're gonna be like, Hey, you spent so much money on this scene, you're gonna watch it again and again if
you have on
also, I guess it it keeps us framed like the whole thing. Why we're back in this kind of world is because of that incident, and it needs to keep coming up,
huh? I think it's intrinsic in the storyline that Yeah, Michael, how do you feel about that?
Yeah, I don't think they need to keep bringing it up. I mean, it was it was a cool scene, but yeah, they just enlist their adding new info every time they show what they wanted to bring it up again. I don't think
I agree I think we're already so limited with just 10 episode, you know, CS
and they're all 45 minutes.
I know. So it's like, you know, I would love it if if they would take out the repeat stuff and just keep the story moving, you know,
I would say, Like, what Jay said Keep on waiting for, Ah, the moment where this there's a payoff for this. Like each time we see it like, maybe there's a hint of something we didn't notice before. And that's way they're doing it if, you know, they won't do a cool story.
But they were just like all scenes from the previous episodes scene, aren't they?
Yeah, I think so.
I just keep looking for it, just in case. Maybe that's where they're going, but I think they're just doing it for the lower, lower rent reason of We spent
of money on this scene. Yeah.
Okay, so I guess we weren't None of us were actually pleased with. So while we're talking about that scene, that was 14 years ago, and that's when we saw the end of his career. But also the end of, um I'm so Sorry. Forgot her name. Refugee. Yeah, that is refugee. Um uh, rough, ese career. What's the name of the pilot? Rios. Okay, that's why I was like, I thought Rafi was him. They're both four. Letter our names. And I remember people's names by how many letters there are in what letter? They start with something. It really Okay. Roughy? Um who, then? Yeah. Keith, I see why you wanted to talk about Buffy. Uh, yeah. So since she was in that scene, let's talk about Rafi. Um, I'm not gonna go first this time.
Uh, let's see, Raffi. I was I'm not totally sure what how I felt. I think it was okay. Like in this word version of Star Trek. Um, you do need to have some resistance to the called up to the adventure. And then she got to do some, like, acting. So instead of like doing what, you know, a normal person would do that.
Card wants me to go to space with Crab Leo,
but like, you know, she needs to, like, do some acting. She needs toe flesh out her character and show some emotions. And, like, you know, that's what actors I guess you guys like to do so I was okay with her torture itself, except for let me see my note that I put down here that I'm forgetting that may bring up later. Oh, I think I know. It is what Serena is what you said about her lifestyle that maybe go. Oh, yeah, that's not happening. And start on Earth anymore.
Yeah. Can I cut in with that? Yes, please. Okay, the thing that keeps is referring to use. Ah, thing that is really bothering me, which is why I definitely have to think of this is an alternate universe. Um, I know that we've kind of been like Gene Roddenberry's vision was too perfect and board the actors and TNT. All right, I get that them having arguments with each other is like a little and realistic, but I'm so the core of it was that we were utopia. That was post scarcity. We all took care of ourselves. We didn't even money anymore. So all of a sudden, having a scene that's like you're rich and I'm poor tells it makes sense in that post scarcity world. So I guess we've just gotten rid of that altogether. And I'm very upset by that, because again, starstruck when I was growing up was kind of like my vision of the world seems hard and harsh now, but we can evolve into something beautiful where we all take care of each other and then taking that away from Star Trek really hurts me.
Oh, I don't agree. I actually
am in the wrappings. Carrie. Yeah, go
ahead. I'm sorry.
Yeah, that's it. And the fact that they were like and she's a stoner because you can't deal with her life made me, like, extra sad, huh? Yeah. Okay.
I was just gonna say commotion respecting Raffi so big shock to everyone. But Raffi is probably my least favorite of the show so far. And
it wasn't that impressed
with, um, I There's so first off. All right, let me just say I'm back. I'm jumping in. All right, First off, um, don't call in jail.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. That was where there was only
so much. It's like, No, he's the captain you're gonna receive, Like, I don't care how casual you are. Off hours, like you're at Starfleet headquarters. Like Pete. He's like,
Yeah, yeah, I'm saying duty.
Like like he like. Don't call him jail. I don't I didn't like that.
Although, although technically he had been relieved of duty, so he was no longer a Starfleet officer. That's true.
But I'm just saying like that. Like John, Look, Picard is a badass. He is the epitome of the captain. Like he is the captain. He does what's right and whether that's against Starfleet or not, which is one thing I love about this show. Um, but he's always done that. But the thing is, he's also commanded a certain amount of respect. And when you start taking away the, um, I can't think of a word. But when you start making a more casual that takes away from that respect feeling, you know what I'm saying? So that the jail thing I didn't like at all actually. And
yes, like at the end of TNG, they were all close friends. But they still you called him captain or Picard. The only person that really didn't was Bev. And still she called him Jean Luc. And like she almost they almost, you know, got to get I know you did get together. Some of the timeline
like, exactly in instant, on good things. You know what I mean? So, yeah,
some to the jail. Yeah. Yeah. Um, so especially on the J. Helping. I also winced. I was like, Oh, each time But they made me think about like, um the expanse of his life and how he grew and changed. So, like, there's an interesting thing where the enterprise d like It felt like it was a life to time to us, like we spent so much time there in like it was incredible. But he actually only spent seven years on Enterprise D, where he spent 22 years on the Stargazer so that when he's been changing throughout time, So like in a stargazer, he spent 22 years. He was like, a pilot first. And then he became a captain. And then I could imagine that he did grow into the top of his game at Enterprise D and became the captain that we know. But then, at the end of that Siri's, he did become more of Ah, maybe I should become friends with my team. And then on his next ship with the Verity with her, I can see that he might evolve as a person and with his relationships. So I don't like it. If I would slap a person if they didn t and g like,
you know, maybe the relationship is different. I like that. But
yeah, now he's involved. I can see that it made me interested in, like So what was the dynamic of his next starship? Like, what was that team? And then it's like another thing that, like people complain about in Star Wars, like all this like flashback stuff, man. Looks like something really interesting happened back then. I wish that was the TV series or the movie. And you know her him being a different captain are different. Starship with New number one is totally different. That sounds so interesting. So, yeah, that's that's my bounce of jail. But I get I get why you guys don't like it, but it's possible evolved, and you would never do that being surprised.
Okay, fair enough. No,
I haven't heard from you yet about I've been quite, um I didn't dislike Raffi or minder as much as the rest of you guys. I mean, I didn't She was my favorite character, but, uh as faras the utopia of the future and Gene Roddenberry's vision. I mean, I guess I never had that that feeling like Sabrina. You did. You know, when you're growing up about it so I don't have that emotional attachment. So my my thought was very it was very like it was kind of just like, Well, even if that you reach utopia doesn't mean it's always gonna stay that way, there's gonna be some some It's not gonna be. You know, I feel like it could not be perfect even though it's utopia is supposed to be. But, um, I feel like there could be people that have fallen through the cracks or whatnot, so I didn't.
But I feel like I'm sorry. I feel like the people who fall through the cracks are usually like colonists, not people who are on the Capitol planet.
True? Um, yeah, and maybe we'll get more of her backstory later, but, um, yes, I guess
especially cause she's ex Starfleet.
Yeah, Yeah, she
shouldn't fall that far. Unless Unless she chose Thio distance herself
and they had the idea that she was fired because the card was weird.
Yeah, that's that I wrote that down to have that same kind of weird. I hope we get more info on that because I just seemed kind of I mean, unless they did something in property, I don't think she should get fired. But I feel
like that's another thing that was for the plot.
To make her disenfranchised
in SciFi books, there's, like, a fluctuation of humanity where we, like, become freaking awesome. Then, like we go through dark periods of sucking some awesome again. So, like while I grit my teeth, I go, Maybe that's what's happening
here. I don't want it to happen,
but, like I can see, that's what they're trying to go for. And also in discovery, I pre sure this story 1000 years of future is like, even sure the federation does fall on the gotta rebuild it.
Yeah. Uh um oh, uh, while we're talking about 1000 year timelines, just like a little thing on the side that I saw somebody mentioned online s o the tell. She are our secret, and they're keeping the secret of the ooze at brash. But the secret is Advil ashes millennia old. So was that before or after the Romans left Vulcan. Maybe Maybe this is a shared history,
E. I don't think
that's related to the episodes that were going on right now. But just while we're talking about time
Well, I don't know because Commodore Oh, is Vulcan. So maybe it does go back to the shared timeline,
you know? Yeah. Yeah. She also fell in love with Karate kid once. Yes. E
um, I love the world giant nerds and world like, Oh, she was in this. Oh, she was in this beautiful. All right, So, uh, anybody else have any thoughts about Rafi?
Um, I do like her. I like I like the performance, but I didn't think it was a great performance. So I saw her acting, um, and giving their all. I didn't think that she did the greatest job in the world, but I saw this year's trying What kind of bounce it out for me?
You saw her acting? Yes. That's that's the issue for me. There a moment. It was like you like you rehearsed those physical moments he rehearsed when you were gonna look away. You shouldn't. Yeah, that's not okay. That is a form of acting
I met. It's just not like I
have to chime in and say it's a little bit disconcerting that vaping still exists in the
way. Maybe that could be medicine or something. And now,
growing her own herbs and the maker paranoid.
Okay, She has a perception say that, didn't you?
So, uh, um, no. We'll follow Rafi along to her next step. Let's talk about Rios and, uh, that ship. Okay, now the ship yet another should be out.
Hold on. Talk about
Let's talk about Rio's first. I'm just gonna cut in with the thing I found interesting. So, um, this ship that Picard is putting together has him ex Starfleet, Rafi, ex Starfleet, Rios, ex Starfleet, and Agnes, who is I think it's still Starfleet, but she's like a science division. Um, so I find it interesting that they're building this, Um, this is the federation now. It's not so great. And everybody that's cool left 10 years ago because of the marks. So they're definitely setting up like again, though. What happened to my country kind thing? Um, I'm just not sure that Star Wars is the place that Star Trek. Sorry, I'm just not sure starting is the place I would have done that, but whatever, it's a story that needs to be told. So how do you feel about Rio's J?
You know, I so far he seems kinda like about asked. I like him. Um, I still it's it's kind of the whole utopia. Think I mean, just to see him with a cigar irks me just because, Well, because it's like it's the whole vaping thing is also very thing. I mean, I get it like they're still wind. There's still alcohol, so of course, there's probably still tobacco, but it's just something I'm not really seen. So at first I was like, Wait a minute, Okay, you know Arnold Schwarzenegger. But then I'm like, Whatever
kind of feels like Star Trek is absorbing other side fi stuff when I'm like, but you are the premier one. You're the one who like, um to steal words from somebody else who talks about video games as in like there's prime video games like Assassin Creed was the 1st 1 to introduce, like climbing out stuff the way you did and then, like uncharted Tomb Raider and stuff copied in Star Trek is the prime show. It's the one that created that world that other worlds like, tried to kind of take. So it doesn't need to take from other side fi shows, in my opinion,
agreed. But but I But at that at the end of it, I do like him. He seems like, you know, he's the the you know. Um, you know, what's funny is I was going to say that, but I wasn't sure like I was trying to cross that line. But he kind of is He's like the tough guy
way were just talking about how it's taking,
you know? But yeah, it's like Malcolm Real. We need to talk about your
chewing the, you know, in the co pilot's seat, and we're switched completely over.
What you mean Chewie? He has an E N H. That looks exactly like him for that. Do you think he has a whole crew of holograms
like just like that is pretty awesome. They all look like you just
stress everyone so much. He's like, screw, start my own crew and it's gonna be me and hologram me and hologram me
and noticed that there
was the MH and the A and e s is like, so, Yeah, I
this is interesting, but, I mean, he seems
he seems like a like, a tough guy, But he also, you know, the whole speech when he was like, Oh, I owe you She told me that you're a speech giver. Um, you know, when When he, uh, when he was, like, breaking down like, Oh, you're start flee to the core. Um, it's it's one of those things where it's like, Okay, like I get it. That's pushing the story forward. And they're trying to kind of, like, make him, um, redeemable, I guess, I guess, Um but still, you know, I'm I'm curious about him. I like this character I liked is acting. Um, you know, I'm curious to see where it's going. And and same thing, I'm kind of curious. I wish we knew a little bit more about his past.
Um, I wish that they let us discover his past instead of having the aim h and the N h tell us. Yeah, that he quit. I feel like they could have done that differently, but I
did not notice the two holograms.
won a nurse and one of the doctors
know e n h stands for emergency navigation
um, So the one bunking game about his injury was medical. And the one bugging him about navigation was the navigation one. Um, Keith?
Um uh, so I think s so we wear an ultimate Star Trek. So sure, I guess I
him. Ah, he's Malcolm Reynolds. He's the rapscallion that everyone likes to have in their show. And, um, my first note on him is that Rio seems to really enjoy acting like he's all in on all three of his characters.
Yeah, I like
wild fun. It seems his doctor version to me, seems like he's auditioning for Doctor who, like, e straight up, looked like he was eventually the doctor himself. Uh, so, yeah, I gotta set and yeah, I
think I like him. He's he's a little too straightforward.
And once again, I think the biggest problem is that, like, no one comes to Star Trek for this, it's like you go to other places for your space cowboy, and you're miss my my smart science astronauts. But you know, if this is what we got Ah, he is having fun, and I think he could be a fun character.
Uh, yeah, Keith, you know this about me. But I used to say that Star Trek was the show that I watched when I wanted something like cerebral and moral. And Star Wars was the movie that I watched when I wanted some action adventure. Yeah, but I feel like this Star Trek is now the action adventure like nemesis Action Picard s. So I'm a little disappointed about that. But I mean, like, Okay, So people who want action adventure Star Trek and watch this and discovery and, uh, Voyager sometimes And, um, if I want my old soft, cerebral star trekking just watched us and tng and yes, yes, I know, I know the Orville I got it.
I think I'm sorry you have to say it. It's It's so Star
Trek. It's crazy, like I don't get this on my off my chest to like So I think what I am experiencing lately infection is what happened to me in comic books where, like, I got into move a ring and X men and like I was having a great time until they change. The writer and the artist also don't turn some uglier and like uncomfortable. It turned out that it wasn't like the brand name that was enjoying. It was like the creative teams that I need to follow instead. So where Star Wars stop doing normal Star Wars Thio get something genuine fun expanse of SciFi. I had to enlist in the Stargate program now that I'm not getting
started here and
now they're looking Star Trek anymore. Um, Seth McFarlane is belting it out of Park by, like Cribbing Hard from T and G. But not
he's definitely TNG specific.
Yeah, he's not. He's not. He's not insulting it. He's not making fun of it. He loves it. It's the same show, and you just get all the things you miss. And yeah, unfortunately, sometimes you have to let go of the brand name and go where the creators are.
That's kind of like the Star Trek continues being so to us. I feel like or fellow so t and G, I'm not saying it's a bad thing. Definitely. Um, did I already ask all three of you about Rios? No,
not me. No. Um, no. I got a very Malcolm Reynolds vibe, which I didn't really mind. Um, yeah, I know, like, card is definitely not my old TNG track that I love. But to me, it just
nemesis Picard. It's fine. It's fine.
It's better than nemesis, but yes, but by between them, Yeah, but, um I don't know. I kind of see it as a natural progression of the card. His character. I mean, it doesn't seem like I'm not watching and being like, Whoa, who is this guy? And I see the card in him. So I don't know. I don't mind the whole action, e you know, tng kind of vibe, but I'm looking forward to see where they're taking it.
This, um, yeah, uh, my feelings about Rios are I agree with you, Keith. I think he's having a lot of fun. And actually, I love his acting. It generally feels like he's arguing with himself, which is particularly difficult when you're not actually talking to another actor in the room. Um uh, I think it says something bizarre about his character that he wants all of his holograms toe look like him. And you just find out specifically why that is. Um I'm curious about his relationship with Rafi, which also makes me curious about that. What's the name of it? Free cloud.
Well, that's the best Where? Yeah, Free cloud. Yeah. Which is why she wanted to go there. Yeah,
it feels like it feels like, um, like, um, last destination, Black market type
planets. Lee. To me, it
feels like if you think a damn cyber cafe like it's
okay, that's what The Internet free cloud free Internet. Yeah, free
clothes. Like come here where you can do all the sketches, stuff on the internet. Your mom told you not
to dio dark way.
Okay, Um, So while we're going through the crew of the ship, um, I'm just gonna throw in there because, you know, I have Thio that Agnes is adorable, but also, um, we're gonna talk about the fight scene later, but, uh, quite like her development so far, even if she's very little of it, Like, all of her actions make sense to me. And she's the one who feels the most Star trek to me like she's genuinely optimistic in excited about the world. And, uh, yeah, yeah. Um, she was just really cute on that ship.
Yeah, she was.
Ah, Keith, this question specifically for you Now that we're done Now that we have seen the inside of the ship, how do you feel
very mass effect? E. Um, yeah, it's called the Last Serena, which is the siren, which I was not sure if they're trying to be cute about sounding like serenity. Um, yeah, the ship's pretty ships Really, really pretty. It's red, white and blue, which are like not for not for p Trak reasons. But I do love the color combination of my characters and spaceships.
It's in a lot of flags.
Yeah, it's it's, um, it's a great hero ship. It's a bit generic for Star Trek. Uh, I just say how we feel about it. So, yeah, once again going back to that thing that we always keep bringing it up. It's not. It's not a Star Trek ship. It looks like it's from mass effect. And, like I would take, it looks awesome. And it's just kind of weird seeing like this kind of kick ass spaceship just dang hanging in orbit above Earth, where where is the Starfleet Fleet and, like they can, like, just randomly beam up and down and nobody says anything. It seems like that should be like a little more regulated and watched out for and maybe even a security risk,
especially since he's like I'm document in the ship's undocumented. So you're like, How do you have easy access? I was thinking the same thing.
What do you guys talking about? The tall Shi'ar showed up with four cards. House. There's clearly no
safety measures on Earth at all, right? Yeah, every time,
every time they do that, um, and like, they start having shootouts inside places. I know it's not a Starfleet chips, so maybe doesn't apply here, but I get that again. Memory of undiscovered country. Where are the mystery was you can't draw a gun in federation territory or each in the starship. That's what you're saying. I'm bridging it too much. But like that, people have wild shootouts on earth in federation territory. And, like people, not like the whole plant doesn't lose her shit. It's kind of like Okay, Okay. Let it go. Let it go. You're shootouts. Do you have in And no, there's no sensors in, like his chateau, even though he's, you know, former admiral. Yeah, um, their little They're playing a little loosey goosey with that starship. It's beautiful, but yeah,
it's, uh it certainly feels like in the last 12 years at some point. But card kind of like accidentally made his way into, like, a slightly alternate universe like he landed in J Js track. And he's like, Oh, I guess I'll just keep going and see what I can do
to make this
world's closer to the one I used to inhabit
on franchise standards eggs exactly what we're doing right now,
their stuff because
otherwise we're just gonna get into, like, production. And
you got to say, I was probably really talked about this in the previous episodes, but, um, but I think it's pretty awesome that two former tell she remembers, like, respect him so much for trying so hard that they chose to
stay todo justice. You missed it
was to stay with that. Have
been talking. Yeah, I've been talking nonstop about how I secretly believe there were three people and I'm angry and chauffeur not
allowing You may have seen a post on Facebook regarding that. Yeah, maybe.
Maybe one word Keith was like, Thank Sabrina. Now, I
can't. I have to see it everyone every time. The next teacher, I'm like, you
know, at night, you know, probably privately. Nice big bed
thing. But I, um I just I think it's so cool. I mean, just that that he and I know that this is past episodes, but just how he was like, No, they're not Ramya Lynn lives their lives. Like it just that was That's my Picard. Like, that's my Picard. I'm not I'm saying and for them to basically, you know, be like you're you're with us now like we're gonna take care. You I mean, because he tried. And that's just it. I mean, there's so much that
don't know that we don't know about the whole, like, Ramya land fall out with everything but the fact that
oh, I have some serious but
the fact that they chose to be with him I mean, that's it's just amazing, like that right there that the 1st 2 episodes were just amazing for me. And this 3rd 1 was my least favorite. But I still have absolutely on board for the show. Like I love I love where it's going
Good. I'm honestly disappointed that they stayed on Earth. I'm glad this happened. Naturally. I didn't even have to, like, do anything for it. Let's talk about the fight scene. Yeah. How do you feel about the fight scene? Let's start with Michael.
I I thought it was awesome. It was really showed. What? You know, those two caretaker want caretakers, but the two towers she are former tennis star could do it. Kind of showed why he keeps him around, I guess. Lovers serving. So it's all good in the Picard hood. Was, um no, I thought it was good. I loved how What's her name? Agnes at the end. Kind of got the last shot. How she came in there and, you know, contributed to the whole thing. But I thought was a great fight scene. Maybe it was on stun. Uh, yeah, you silly girl. Poor Agnes Day. But,
you know, actually, I think it was a great fight. Seem, um, I think it makes total sense that there, like hidden guns everywhere. They're hidden phasers everywhere. Yeah, because yeah,
from the tell you. Yeah, yeah,
yeah. So I mean, yeah. And then, um, the fight scene itself was pretty amazing, You know that. I mean, just visually cinematography wise. Like it was like when I forget her name. But when the women get slammed back and breaks the glass with the back of her head and you see it through the other side, ask the shots. And the fight itself was just epic and beautiful and amazing. Um, and then Agostino shooting and dealing. Maybe it's done. It's done. That was adorable. Just her reaction with her. And she is such a good actress, her like, she's so like, you just want to like hunger.
Yeah, Yeah, I d'oh d'oh!
But but the one thing that I will say when the guy was tied up like, Come on, when you're If you're tell Shi'ar or Josh or whatever, if you're someone to interrogating you, you're not gonna say anything like the guy was just like she's the destroyer. She's this that blah, blah, blah. Dude, come on. Like even people that are in the military. No, you don't say anything.
But Jay, if he doesn't break immediately, even though the only thing they did to him was spray them with water, How is the show going to tell us this information,
you know? Yeah, Jay. Yeah, I know, I know. How dare I? I know.
Uh, actually, you were in here for that, But I did complain in a past episode about how I feel like the show was telling me too much stuff and not letting me figure it out myself. Yeah. So, um, I had that feeling, uh, with that seem. But it did give me all the information I needed to form a fully formed theory. So we'll hit that at the end of year. Um, Keith, fight scene.
Um, Well choreographed. Well shot. I did cheer when she got her head smashed into that door. That shot
was amazing. Just like we left her with shots. Great. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
yeah. You know, like, um, I like if you're in a fight, if you're one of my heroes on the screen, you got take hits and be able to take it and survive and then rise above lake. If you don't take any hits, I'm gonna roll my eyes at the fight. But, uh, she took it and it was awesome in, um Then I'm like,
you should do
this in Star Trek, but
Yeah. Listen, listen, go And then,
like, I like Theseus ound effects. I like the Blaster designs. Um oh, and to be petty for one second about this. Tell c r a couple I don't like the guy. I don't like your face.
I'm being weird about it. Whoa, things is not This is this is a vet's face. Yeah, it's just a petty
thing and that doesn't matter. And like should not be held against him or the
show. It's my own problems, but for some reason I see him, he looks too freaking pleasant and it's bothering me. You're like, Yeah, he's so, so perfectly pleasant. It just great sonny like, like go to a coffee shop or something and I'm like, Yeah, so just for some reason, look, it's a minor
but Lake and it is death and wrong with him and there's nothing wrong with the character. This is totally just like my problem
that Tze bin just like every time you guys like me I love these two and just like we'll do another episode about,
um Oh, don't worry. When the show's over, we're gonna keep going.
I have to
talk about characters. We're gonna have shows to talk about, like storylines were. If you guys think that I'm not gonna write down all the theories that you tell me and they give you a scoreboard of who
dispensed with the end of the series. I mean, you're wrong. I'm doing it.
Why do you think I keep asking you what your theories are? E wanna win? I mean, I just want to see Interesting story
am so glad I'm so glad that you want to win.
But I'm just I'm just Yeah, I think there's a friend. You're
not saying it is
a friend. I think it is.
Okay. You're saying it is a friend and not a combatant?
No, I was just honest. Yeah. There you go.
I I agree with you. I thought, like about the guns being hidden everywhere, Like do I expect that on Earth? No. Do I expect that in the household with to tell she our members who are protective of Picard? Yes. Um, I think it would have been funny if the Telstar had pulled out the guns and the Picard was like, Wait, hold on a second. You've been hiding those in my house this whole time. But
a fair enough that you would already know about
them. They reach it or not there because he doesn't like
guns. I got rid of him. I'm sorry.
I like to believe that they were shooting on killing. He was shooting on stun.
That, actually, how did that one guy survive? Did you see which shot was the guy that they got tied up?
No, but maybe we should treat sit back. And maybe it turns out exactly that. Picard, if you send in the
rest of that one, I hope, frankly, the Chelsea
are using federation weapons.
I have a blue. It's believed they have
done the Silva. From what I understand, the Rommie Island Disruptors shot the red. You're right. The red kind of pulse on the really warm before the federation where we're Picard's. From what I understand. Cool.
Um, yeah, I'm not sure. We can tell if it's killer stunned from the color, though, because, uh, I mean, you can see it, especially in S t o. But Star Trek typically has, like, federation. Who's gonna have blue weapons? Rommie lands. We're gonna have green weapons. Borg is gonna have green weapons, Klingons, They're gonna have red weapons, you know. So, uh, not sure. Okay. I thought that that moment with Agnes was wonderful. Um, that she shoots him to protect the card and then, like, cannot handle the fact that she may have killed someone. Um, I hope that that comes up more in the future, and we'll see. As like, she's the the Avatar of, like, the softness that slowly gets crushed by the world being. I mean, even though that's not what I expect from something that's centered. But they are leaving earth now, so I think I'll be a little less frustrated. Um, yeah. Anything
else we want to win with him, there's no reason they should
have gone with him. He's like that. They're the muscle.
Yeah, I am. I'm disappointed that they're not on the ship. Maybe they will be. Maybe there's gonna have a story line on Earth. I definitely want more of that. Agree. I'm sorry. You don't like the dude.
I don't wear that. Just like you know,
You have to agree that Irish Romi Lin is
the, um, the one. I like her a lot. Yes.
Oh, and I did say last episode, I thought maybe it was Well, you were right. It is Irish. I'm rather, um Okay, Uh, do any of you have anything else to say about our lovely tells you are a couple.
Just that the blaster designs click just now in our conversation where I had a spider sense tingle where, like when they're drawing their weapons. Now, it's just like thinking that all the weapons on the screen where Robin Island. But I do like that we cared enough to differentiate the weapons and designs.
I didn't think it was a good thing. It was funny when she slapped the guy in the head and was just like northerners, you know? Thank you. Just like, you know, like and I thought that was kind of funny just cause people kind of give her flat for having an Irish accent, even though, like who? Who? They're aliens. Who cares? What accent? You know what I mean. But, uh, I do love that she liked differentiated herself. Like how you northerners or whatever.
Yeah. Um, yeah, that was funny.
And then one last thing would be I get massively frustrated if, like, you have your main characters that get jumped by care, bad guys of weapons, and then the next scene they don't have extra weapons like E. I guess he doesn't need it. But I just I was like when that scene was over, and they had all those weapons scattered around, I was kind of hoping that I'd see the card, like, you know, put one in his jacket because, like,
need a blaster in space.
Well, the toast you are after us. All right, So I think we're good on that story line. So we're gonna head over to that Rommel inboard ship. They finally answered that question that we had about who was running the things. The Borg are still on the ship. That's why there's Federation and Rami lands on it. But it seems the Romulans are running things again with their thing with secrecy. It must been required of them to allow other species on there because I feel like otherwise they'd be, like, hot interested. The information will be all ours. Um, let's let's avoid talking about the prophecy scene for a sec. So even, like cover the other ground first. And then we'll specify on that one um So I thought it was funny. Thio. Last episode we saw the tell share twins or whatever this advice twins or whatever. The boring the girl talking. And she was, like, still her human Starfleet. And now she's, like, in her Romeo himself. And I'm like, Wait, did you just leave Earth without telling anyone? Um, how did you feel about the Borg stuff going out on the
bum Cube? I think that
he was an incredible actor. Holy shit. Uh, I was waiting
for him. Thio, you know, like, I didn't take his imdb. So I haven't I'm not sure like how much he's been acting since Star Trek, but kind expected him to be kind of forcing it like, Oh, God, you guys do this again, All right? And then, like, you know, he'd say, you know, some force lines, but we're glad he's there, but, uh, he was once he was killing it. Um, he had a leered, almost like I don't even go there. Even though I don't know if I'm using the term right Shakespearean kind of like drama, acting like he was really deeply into it. I liked his performance. I think that Dodge Slash. So G is a merry suit. I don't use this in the sexist way that here can be used, but more of, like be, Hey, I, uh, we can smell our own, Uh, because, like, I exclusively wrote Mary, see characters is really nice to me and never like, you know, took me to task for it. But yeah, this is exactly what I did. And it's not It's not good. It's fun for yourself. But yeah, if she's gonna be a good hold your Star Trek standards like
she knows all the things.
Yeah, and I want I like it with what I'm interest to, like a low level character who has to build up not a high level character who started off it like Level 20 like on the first
of the chosen. One thing. It's already been done very intelligently by Star Trek with Cisco. So, um, uh, have more to say about that later, but that's gonna be in the theory section. Jay, how do you feel about what's going on?
So back to the abbreviations? I don't like that they call the Max Bees
the export. It's
like like I just I mean don't get me wrong like I get it.
You called him
so yeah, I get it. But it's like, Come on, Don't know. Like I think
it's like it's
too easy and it's it's Ah, it's like, uh, I can't think the word But anyway, I just I'm just not a fan of abbreviations. Apparently, I didn't know
that about myself until this x b two. That's community cash tagged on my story.
Jay, there's no way I will ever believe that.
You never know. I'm a gram and a watcher for life. You know me. But actually, But on the Borg ship, the scenes actually, I really do love Hugh is amazing. And, uh, Jonathan Del Arco is the actor's name. He is phenomenal and he's beautiful and he is just so talented And, um, he really is. It's interesting because he was come a long way from what we blasting him At and T and G, and, um just to see him in that kind of like leadership role with so G and like with being in charge, um, like it, it kind of makes me wonder. I want to know what happened between TNG and this with you like. I want to know more about you because Hugh has has come a long way, and and he's already a character that we a really, um, connected to from TD. Yeah, Um, so just there's so much that I want to know about him, but the scenes themselves, like on the ship, is awesome. The scenes with him and just and so g just they work so well together. And he's so good. Um, and then ah, and I can not going in the prophecy scene. But, you know, just everything else on the on the cube, you know, with the, um with her being so smart and being able to pick things up, like, you know, like, oh, I just ask and
just magically knows
you would think that she would pick up on the guy, like, kind of using her. You know what I'm saying?
Like first room. And like I mean, so it's like, you know, he's the hot Rommie. Alan, come on. I got something to say about
that. You do? Um, no, but I uh um but that being said, maybe maybe she does know, you know, Say, like, maybe she It's a theory, you know, But maybe she does know that there's something else going, but it's just the scenes are great. The Borg Cube is cool. You know, Sabrina, you know I love Borg s o they There's a Borg cube. That's be recommitted. That that is like that has all these different species on it, including the export, not X B. Um, that's ah, I think it's super cool. You know, I'm really I'm really enjoying that aspect of it.
Um, it's just timing, like the what issue been doing between the show. And now, um, I have a little story. I ran into him once in the beta quadrant, deep in space cells of like
Yes, I am. Yeah, I was looking into a distress beacon and like me and the pin dragon, too. I got jumped by a whole bunch of boring. We're outmatched. Outnumbered. It was almost yen and a huge jumps in on his new kind of It's not a Cube is a weird his own starship that he has. And he helped save the day. And like his story that I saw there was like, he explores the galaxy differently. The still bored. They're still connected on his ship, but he explores the galaxy differently, even with interesting.
So so he's still in Is, like many
collective. That's interesting. I wonder what happened to his make. Like Michael. Uh, yeah, I liked, um, like how they introduced you into this episode. They didn't just He just kind of walked onto the scene. It wasn't some big hoopla. I agree. His acting is incredible. I think he's done a really good job. One thing about a show I know when I like it a lot is when I want to know the back story. And I want to know what happened happened to Hugh between, you know, tng. And now, um, you know, whether it's I don't I wish that I hope they do like a novel on that or something, cause I'd love to know what happens to him,
and I boarded such a
treasure. Yeah, I love that e. Believe it.
All right. Um, yeah. So that Rommie Luke, let's talk about him for a sec. I do feel like the he's evil is being, like, emphasize a little too much. So I do expect a turncoat moment where he's like, Ha ha. screw you, sister. I'm on surgery. Said that being said, I do think the can I tell you a secret I may be falling in love with? He was definitely a
trick. He's not underside yet. That's a big of course.
Um, and you guys already know. I like that actor. Whatever he's got. Um uh, so G I actually I haven't mentioned it before, but her acting has been a bit of a struggle for me. Like she keeps touching her hair and to get it out of the camera and stuff like that. And I'm like, Girl, you gotta breathe. But she did better in this episode. Um, I believed her more. It is difficult to play a character like that because she has to be, like, wide eyed and innocent and simultaneously know everything. Um, I'm not necessarily going to disagree with you about her being a mayor, Sue, but I have a feeling that has a lot to do with the reveal. So I'm gonna talk about that in my theory later. Um,
are we willing to talk about the sister? Because I need to say something about that? Um, the sister is the twin brother
um, I'm not sure they ever specified that they were identical twins.
Oh, snap, Snap in now. I'm not sure anymore. I think
the reason you thought that they would be identical is because when you heard that he had a twin, you were like, Oh, he's also a robot. So yeah, Android. So, uh, they never specified that, But maybe we will see. And I
have. This is
I'm always in for some extra transferred cannon's because people so rarely put actual trans characters into shows. Yeah, head can is a great
they do it this time.
I really freaking hope they dio I will be extremely excited. If there's one thing that I can say about Star Trek now and then is that it doesn't treat token token. It doesn't do tokenism. It actually treats, um, minorities, people of color. Ah, women as characters. And it doesn't make a massive deal about it like, huh? Let's go all the way back to tea or west. There was that episode with, ah, the creature that was becoming what everybody else wanted. And for her, uh, it became this big African guy who spoke her language literally and, ah, like That was great. It's just like, you know, it spoke to her heritage without using any stereotypes. Um, I mean, it did do the, you know, they have to be the same race, but this is the sixties. Um, and you have to make some allowances for that, or else we will never be able to develop. Like if we can't forgive her past Selves for making mistakes that we fixed how we're gonna fix our mistakes now in improving the future. Anyway, um, uh, you guys said all that needed to be said about Hugh, except for one thing that I'm just gonna tack on. He's, ah, costume designers. His makeup people did an excellent job. That whole left part. The eye patch of skin, Little Borg bits underneath. It looks like it's the same kind of height as the right side of his face. They just didn't get there. Um, all right, so let's talk about the scene. You know the scene. I'm talking about the prophecy. Seen Who wants to go first? Uh, Michael, I keep making you go last night. You're going
first? Yeah. I thought it was a good scene. I thought the actress that played a camera with the name of that lady, the Romney lean Romney island. Yeah, I thought she didn't. Excellent job again. It just made me want to know more about it. Which I guess that's the point of the show. I mean, that's I want you to tune into the next episode. But I wanted to know what they called the destroyer. Right?
She said there were two ones. Good ones bad. And the bad one is the destroyer.
Yeah. Andi, you should have asked, You know which one were you? And I don't know what you know. If saying somebody's the destroyers a pretty heavy thing toe t say it's so it just makes me want to know more about it. But I thought the scene was great.
I'll see. So, um yeah, like her being destroyer does seem what's getting like I'm most important person in the universe. I think the best way they could do it is like a thing that kind of people wanted to do with Ray, where if you're that powerful, you keep, you know, steamrolling everything. What if you are the last guy like and she turns around and all this time she's been playing people, but I guess that wouldn't be it if she's getting controlled by what I think. Is there a I Mom,
I Mom is funny.
Yeah, so, yeah. Um uh, I thought it was I couldn't tell if this ah line she keeps doing is great or too on the nose. The shared narrative experience understanding, trauma rooted, deep archetypes relevant Today's news. And that's like and and like, how people work through their trauma. Like I think she's talking about Star Trek off. The Phantom's people have, like, a shared near the framework of Star Trek, and that connects them. And I guess, like probably all of us have used these as, like parables to get through the traumas that we've experienced in life. So
a little mad after seeing it, Yeah, we're saying it
out loud like that was like,
I think I like that. But what's that to under those, like
I'm still deciding? And then also once again like it. Star Trek was parables like where you get your self contained story and, like, everybody's pretty human in it. And you understand, like the reason why some aliens are assholes and wide variation stands against it. And this they're mirroring the news too much. They're not explaining enough. The real nous behind why people are assholes. And they're kind of telling you like which site is good? Yeah, that's my problem I'm having with it. But yeah, I like to seem a lot well acted. Well, fun. And we'll see. It turns out
what's that other dude doing with a gun in that room? Like, how did you get that? Okay,
I think she grabbed it from a security guard. She didn't grab it from another one of the Romulans. It was a security guard. Yeah,
hope not. Um, who Interesting thing about makeup that I kind of laughed about. I noticed that every single export Romulan was missing. One eyebrow. Not the same one. Never. Both. Just one eyebrow. They're all missing. One. I j.
I thought the seam was actually really interesting. The whole spirit, like the talk of, you know, I know you. I know you from tomorrow. I mean, like it, really, you know, And then which one are you? The one that dies of the one that lives, you know? And you're the destroyer. I mean, it's It's like a prophet ish, you know, which is like
prophetic or whatnot. Um, you know, it's like I'm curious. It's kind like when Michael saying it really makes me want to know what's going on, like it It makes me think like, Okay, how does she know what's coming? Like what's going on? You know, um and it's there's just something there that I can't quite put my finger on that I'm very, very interested to find out about. You know what I'm saying? Because
I'll put your,
uh um, but it's one of those things where it was a very good scene. It was amazing. It was really interesting to see. So Ji use the the tactics of like, hey, they don't have front doors or they have fake front doors. But everyone the real way in is through the back. So she moves the chair and goes behind her and tries to do things in a very specific Robbie one way and it works. You know it and she starts to open up to her and it was just very, um very well thought out. And just very it was just a very, very cool scene. and then just the whole like future. Like, can she see the future? Can she like, How does she know what's coming? What's what's that about? Like, Was it assimilated? And then it's stuff in her mind. Like somehow the board can see, like, what's coming or something? I don't know. I mean, I don't know, but anyway, it was a great scene.
Maybe it's something about her sister. Maybe Rommie Linds secretly have, Ah, truth like fortune telling abilities that they haven't. I told them I did quite like how That's
just I didn't put
like a zoo, pointed out, uh, have the kind of showed us glimpses of Romeo and culture through what she did and didn't want to. What I found particularly interesting. Um, was this So J is trying to get Rommel in mythology, and the lady says we don't have a word for mythology and Rommel, And she says, What's your word from mythology? And she says news, Um, so ji, translate, this is translates this as being like she I just didn't understand it the same way she did to me when she says, Uh, there's no mythology. There is news, which he actually means is, uh, mythology is, you know, fake. They're parables. They're exaggerations of what actually happened there, um, constructed stories to explain why the world is the way it is. Whereas Romney land quote unquote mythology is news, it's actual history. They don't have a created mythology. They only have what actually happened in their past. That's how I translated that. So anything that's so ji kind of like believes is being a myth, you know, like the destroy is very, uh, like Shiva kind of duality. One of them is the creator of one of them is the destroyer. Um, so that sounds like mythology to her. But then the Romulan ladies saying like, that's not a story that really happened. Um,
I think we're hearing the voice of the writer event line where he's saying he's saying that I'm using this the shared framework of the narrative. Ah, that's relevant apnea. That's relative to the news and that they think it's their moral responsibility to use this platform. They have to help America. I appreciate that idea so much. And like, I do agree with what
they're saying. I just wish I
hadn't done. It starts. Yeah,
we can't do it
like this because it's pandering. It's not going to get through to the people who might need to get anyway. Yeah,
but also, I just I needed one of my scifi shows to be positive. Just one?
Uh huh. I think there's, I think a
talking about a show.
Say, uh oh, my God. I get it on TV. Oh, okay. Everybody
into your Michael Do other. Either of you have thoughts about that mythologies news thing?
No, I when I when I heard that it was kind of like they were talking about the whole fake news stuff that, you know we've been dealing with.
Oh, that's an interesting thought. Yeah.
Oh, yeah, That is different. Actually, I didn't think
especially cause the Romney leads air suits, secretive and kind of controlling of each other. Fake news seems
like a thing that would definitely happen there. Yeah, so
sorry. Thank you. Let's use its original name
problem. Great, actually,
I mean, I'll admit I, uh I didn't even think of that stuff. What I think of is how how, um, make mythologies are based on truth. They're they're expanding their elaborated on, but at the core it's, it's it's coming. It's just the that everything is based on some sort of truth. And it's just knowing how to weed out the truth beyond all the bloat. Being out of the same.
Yeah, that's nice. Good sentiment way. Need
to do one thing positive. Oh, yeah, Way were dying without
I'm back, baby.
Okay, so that's actually my whole list that I wanted to talk about, except for the theories which I want to keep it. The end and one thing I'm gonna throw in really fast. Uh, some of the tricky going on with the starter. Picard. I haven't watched for Episode three the next time on because episode wanted to both of them next time. Like next on Picard. They have shown us characters that were not in the next episode, and
I feel like they're playing like in the first episode.
They were like Jerry Ryan. But we haven't seen Jerry Ryan yet. At the end of the 2nd 1 that were like that ravioli with the sword. We haven't seen the Romulan with short hair,
at least for the 1st 1 This is the thing. That's what they've been doing for a couple years now, where you do your first big episode, we'll welcome here. And here's the previous for what's gonna happen to the rest of the series. That's what I've been seeing in a lot of the first episode on a second episode. I'm not sure if yeah,
I'm just feeling slightly like Thio like they're like, Here's a cool characters. Keep watching. I mean, they're not gonna be in this yet, but keep watching.
I think that you're letting that go as of this episode, but if they dio sends, yeah, that's cool.
I think you're right, because this episode is like finally on the ship. So we're done with set up and hopefully we'll get into
that. Well, they they said the 1st 3 episodes were just setting it up, so I mean, yeah,
right, Exactly. Um, right, So that's now that I've mentioned that that's my whole list. Um, Michael, is there anything you wanted to talk about?
The only thing I want to mention was I loved and I got goose bumps when at the end, when he said, engage, I'm sorry if I'm the only one, but I was like, I literally I was like, Oh, my God, it's You know, I just e give me the good field. So I feel like a child. I squealed a little bit, too. I'm not gonna lie. I smiled pleasantly. I smiled. That's okay. Hey, let's go.
I would like to have been blown away. I wasn't because I e spanned much in the premium.
I knew it was coming, but I was still off the set up to. It was pretty
brilliant, too, because everyone just looks up at him, united me like everyone on the ship, and he's not the captain at all.
Everyone just looks at him. And then he just kind of smirks. And
it was like, It is the capital. You will always be the captain's chair. Uh um
ah, yeah. I mean, while we're gonna talk about the engaged moment, they also did some emotional trickery there when he looks at the chair and it starts the
team. Yeah, I
noticed that, too. I gotta laugh about it, though, because this is the first episode that we didn't get the Earl Grey reference. So instead, they made it. Um, but again, you know, like fan service is not a thing that I'm a fan of. But obviously, many fans are fan of fan service. So that
way, you know that.
So I'm not upset about the age thing. It was a nice moment. I liked it. I just Ah, whenever I hear sound cues from other things, I'm always like you guys. You're trying to trick me because Star Wars did it all the time where they were just like, here's this beautiful sound cues. Then it was like, Wait, the contents of this is not the same. Don't try to make me cry just by using this. Hold on.
My my only gripe would that was just like a personal gripe. Being petty is Ah, it's that Starfleet ship like you're playing the music. You're saying engaged and we're, like on a massive, like firefly ship. Okay,
but yeah, yeah, I'll let it go. Let it go. I think
it was reflecting his inner feeling of like returning on the captain's chair.
Yeah, um, on that I have a note where I do feel they're doing good with Picard. I feel this is kind of reversed. Jet. I reverse the last. Yet I The last data is now a cautionary tale. And I think Ryan Johnson did that on purpose, like no one wants to see that done to the favorite character ever again. Ah, lot of people don't want to that I mean, I'll say and like, that's what I was waiting for him like a lot of people were worried about. Like, we're going to get Picard in like he's gonna hate science and exploration in helping people and like, we're like, Oh, God, then we have to see him become himself again. But he's not that he's all for helping people. He couldn't wait to get back in the space and light that there Ah, they're paying respect to him. But he has changed as a person, which does feel organic. So I am okay with that. And I'm liking that Picard is being treated respect.
Yeah, I definitely feel like the things that feel different about Picard to me don't feel like their internal, but more in response to the fact that this is no longer utopia. So, like, the card in and non utopia is like this. Yeah. So, um, many of my friends are, like, not many of my friends, some of the people that I watched with have been like the car does not himself. And I joked about that earlier when I said he wasn't he a Jew? Picard. He's a nemesis, Picard. But what I actually meant by that was that, like, it's a lot more actually, um, and he's a lot more willing to just shoot people, whereas and tng who was more like, Hold on, hold on, hold on, Let's try diplomacy first. But, um, I really do feel that the essence of Picard has been preserved. Um,
well, then it's been 20 years, so he's gonna change a little bit.
Yeah, right. Exactly. He's just being affected by the world being,
And I liked and like, your name, say your Starfleet to
the cool. All right. That is like
a lobular mad, that discovery. We saw a lot of shady Starfleet and then here receiving Ask. Well, Starfleet. But Picard remembers what Starfleet means. That means a lot. That and then that we have a character he that he believes in makes me feel pretty
good that, like, all right,
you know that they aren't trying to subvert expectations like saying the jet I suck and Starfleet's always sucked. No, no, no. There's a ideal that Picard was a part of that. He still believes him
and that this Han solo guy secretly has a
heart of gold. Yeah, And I think
the car could just smell your heart of gold.
And I think that just,
you know, Yeah, it's been 20 years, but and then he's changed. But just just don't call him jail. Please.
Yeah, I agree. Except for Rafi, Where you know, they they had a really shit. We don't get to see, so, you know, like for me. And I wouldn't call him that, but Raphael know, eh? Pretty you in Picard. So
I mean, um, we don't really know her, right. If she was, like, first Officer on the Stargazer, then like maybe I guess
not the star Gates. No, no, not for Geyser. Yeah,
the charity's very geysers after starting as
there was before. Yeah, you're right. Um, like with the doctor he saw again. Which are we going to see him again? Or was he there just to remind us that people think that because I might be going crazy?
Well, if you remember, he did have in all good things. We find out that he has that disease, that brain memory disease.
you're a medic.
about your romantic sounding too J you have to listen to the podcast.
Oh, I'm such a bad co host. I'm sorry. I've been sick.
That's no excuse, because I've only been doing I'm
on disability. It's I don't know why I haven't listened to it. I know. No excuses.
It's OK. We forgive you, but Ah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
You're America syndrome is a deterrent. Did trade of the neurological disorder classes
so we wouldn't talk about it briefly. I mean, just, um, cover you guys can, uh I don't remember what your opinion was. No,
we owe. You don't have to revisit it.
The I know just the thing about the Senate room was that a I am I felt like it would have been really fun for them to narratively mess with, like, Is Picard crazy or not? I feel like they made it clear that he's not crazy, and they just kind of brought in fact so that it gives other people an excuse not to believe the card. You know, like members of Starfleet and stuff. But I do like that. They referenced it anyway because it means that they're paying attention to the details of the cards. Just like the theme comes from the flute.
Yes. Arrested recipe. And,
um all right, So, Michael, that was your thing. Keith, is there anything you wanted to talk about that I haven't brought up yet?
Let me see here. I think I've hit all of my notes and Oh, um, they mentioned that. Ah, it sounded like Let me know if I heard this incorrectly. Did they say that, um, in that room were the only raw Mulan's ever assimilated by the
Borg? Think so? I don't know. I thought I heard that.
Yeah, it seemed kind of weird. And they made me think about like, why are there lots of different humans throughout the galaxy? But we don't have lots of different kind of Vulcans throughout the galaxy. Like you don't have a plan or do we? Actually, we might have seen one, actually. So Yeah, I was just saying, like, you don't go to a random planet and you go to run the plant, you'll find a human. You don't go to any plans and find alternate Frankie or alternate Vulcans for this one where they had to hide themselves. Program.
Mmm Mmm. Okay. That reminds me of a tus seen, uh, we run into it is his home words red and ass. We run into one of the ancient Greek gods on a planet. And when I say we I mean Kirk Spark, you know, and whoever ran in person, they bring down on the planet. I think it's Chekhov and then a lady that
we never see again, remember?
And they talk about Is this the right episode through this? Whatever he's like, how high was a gun on Earth? And cooks like, I believe, that there was an alien species that showed up to Earth when we were still very young and that professed themselves as gods because we couldn't understand their powers and left. Maybe it's a different episode, but somebody mentions how the humans are everywhere because, uh, there was an ancient civilization that went around kind of like Star Gate is dropping like, see, seeding the different planets. And Kirk goes, No, no, no, no. We have proof of evolution on Earth. We know that didn't happen. And then spot goes. Actually, this fits with Vulcan mythology. That might have been where we came
from. It was Yeah. Was it? Yeah.
I remember to us the best, because, uh, yeah, I'm
a tus girl. There's this
amazing, like, archaeological chiefs around the galaxy between, like, all the major races. And then they get to the final planet in this hologram goes Ah, you have found me. I am why you guys all look humanoid because we see the galaxy, and then we left and you're all like one person and be
cool. Three excellent dream like everybody besides a baby excites. The humans were like that. Stupid. That eyes I'm out based on the humans were
like, Oh, that makes sense. But like, But what? My question was more like, That's why you have human ways around the galaxy. But we don't have different kinds of Vulcans were different kinds of freeing years.
What are you talking about? Rommie, lives are different kinds of, um
they are actually Vulcans origin,
but they've developed Head Ridge isn't
Yeah, but over in the Gamma Quadrant, you confined just like a normal human. That's true. You can't find a normal clean on.
just the world building. Like,
yeah, yeah. You know, like humans writing about humans kind of things.
Yeah. There you go.
Actually, I'm glad you brought that up, too, because it gives me great example. I just want to talk about fan service again for a sec. Um, I do think that there's different levels. There's, like, you know, self referential where you have the card ordering Earl Grey. And that could be fine. I personally don't like it. I know you guys do. I have no issue with that. I think it's great that people will think it's it's fun. Um, but ah, fancy Perceval never complain about is like that TNG episode pulling that to US episode reference and then building a story from it because it's used for the story building. It marries them together. It reinforces the fact that they happen in the same universe. It shows that the writers paid attention to their source material, and I I love stuff like that, which is why I love so much that they brought up the the aromatic syndrome. Even if I feel like they didn't use it toe, it's full capacity. It's don't please. Um, yeah. Anything else? You want to suck it?
Uh, that is all of them.
I've I've covered my hatred of Ah, abbreviation. So yeah, we're good.
That was most probably upset. Okay, So before we hit theory is just your favorite part of the episode and your least favorite river Slattery your least favorite part of the episode in your favorite part of the episode, J I think you're I know what you're gonna say for your favorite
abbreviations. What's shot? Um, jail XB. It's like, Come on, come on. But my favorite, actually, um what would be the engage Engage? I mean, dude, I just squealed like a little kid. It's like, Come on. Like I mean, of course, it's like, the easy win, but I'm like, Ah, it just makes my heart happy.
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Keep,
um, at least favorite would be Mr Pleasant Man face who should be going to his cafe. And so being hanging up card, um, and then my favorite thing would be, uh oh, that there still, the Picard still himself that he hasn't given up all of his court values and that he still cares about it even of the world's changed around him. He still cares about things that I cared about to start.
Um, at least favorite part was that his two Rommie Lind companions didn't go with him. Yeah. I mean, with their, uh, you know, fighting skills. It seemed like a natural thing. But anyway, and my favorite part was the character, Raffi. No, I'm just kidding. It was the It was the engaged. It was the engage part. Of course, I love that. I could I could almost hear j squealing from here from Colorado.
Um, let's see my least favorite part. Probably just the whole baskets rock thing like I'm Ah, you're rich. And I'm poor just cause that, just like that, was the final strong, like breaking the Roddenberry trick for me. Um, of, like at the very basic course. Starts like it was like the federation goes out to discover new planets because we've already solved earth. Well, we're not even in a post scarcity. It's not even that our attitudes have changed. We're not in a post scarcity world anymore. I mean, like, what? What happened to the ability to just make food with the Replicator? Why Is that happening? When we went on earth in D s nine, Um, Cisco's dad was running a restaurant because that's what he cared about. But note that people came into his restaurant. Nobody paid for the meals. They all just came in and had a good time because there was no money. Because it's
Yeah, okay. But if your social commentary so important, then you have to remove a bass. Part of the world's I'm disappointed in you.
Amen. Well, you Yeah.
So, again, I'm just gonna think of future. Picard is being like a card from TNG landed in an alternate universe where apparently we don't need replicators. Oh, which brings them put. Funny thing. Uh, Cynthia Hall, I guess, is not a thing anymore, because everyone's actually, but I'm not sad about that. I think the concept is that the hole was kind of ridiculous in the first place that, like, we would drink fake alcohol. That doesn't make us drunk, like Sorry. Alcohol doesn't taste that good.
I thought I'd still make you drunk. It doesn't I don't think so. Um, you wonder that was hiding. And that gave me that illegal Robbie one else. And that's medicinal. My favorite
part. Ah, and I don't want to devalue some of the other stuff that's going on. There are other things that I like, but, um, I was just pulling away by them the 14 years ago. Uniforms are
so no, I don't
like I would switch my s t o character to that costume because it's just Yeah, please make a show with those things, and
it looks like a painter, so, uh, but it looks it looks so dope. Okay, so my favorite part, let's talk about theories and ah, you guys, we're gonna have to get used to be pulling this out, so maybe maybe you can plan ahead.
I don't like to put
you on the spot every time. Um, but just gonna go last because I feel like I'm springing this on him too quickly. Uh, Keith, do you have any theories about what's gonna happen in the future? Like maybe about this, like the twins being to destroy one of them being the destroyer? Or about what's gonna happen with hot Rommie Lynn or whatever.
Um, now I'm a little salty because you called me out on like, how the guy never said he had an identical time. I was, I thought was a private. Now I was gonna be like, Yeah, I was like,
Guys, look, I know the future if you hold, this is the twist you guys don't see coming because he mentioned a twin we haven't seen yet. We don't. C one and c called my brother and wait. Maybe just twins like that. Um, sorry. So,
yeah, that's what I had prepared. And, like, I was gonna be all, like, one of my crown in Cape and be all cool.
Hey, I mean, they didn't specify that she was his twin. Maybe he has an older sister and a twin. You might still be right.
I think you're right. Now, I think that's just is just his twin. It's not. There's no sex change. There's no twist on that.
All right, well, I'm sorry. Erected for you.
Um uh, that, uh, what would happen in the future is that Well, they gotta find Maddox, and I'm positive that Mannix is behind the mom.
Yeah, yeah, yeah. You have the theory Episode one and one. Am I'm pumped up again. I was like, you know, what I think he was right.
Yeah, that's what I configure for. Now, um, if I come from anything, whatever you want stalking else
who, um And actually, you bring up an interesting point. Um, side note, uh, so G knew about her sister. Oh, yeah, but I don't recall her sister knowing about so g
I saw that, too. But
since the hologram was like that anyway,
no. No, they didn't. They do you like they did. Ah, the the agent that I do like with Picard. They did that investigation. It shows they been talking to each other, right?
Oh. Were they talking to each other? I thought that was like her face had lugged into her sister's account.
I thought her a m um They talked to one of them about the other one in the So they knew about each other. I thought,
I know, I know. So he knows about her sister, But I didn't I wasn't sure. One both was
same. I thought for some reason, I thought Dodge didn't know.
No, I think I watch him again. Then I think she needs to
the investigation, then maybe that investigation and like the thing they were catching for is like two faces looking each other that insane.
I think they called each other when they're doing the investigation. They, uh that's how they found so G was because So Jim Dodge What were you talking to each other and the computer thought that so ji was Dodge and got confused for a minute. Because it's like, Why are you calling in if you're calling out to you? And that's how they caught it.
Uh, I have
a I am holograms, but they did not
pro, but they're they're e
identical Androids, so they're the same truth.
I definitely translated that the other way. That, um, thes the way systems work now is that you can kind of Le Guin to your own account, like anywhere, because it uses facial recognition fingerprinting, whatever. Um, voice prints. So, um, like, if you go on, if I right now, went on vacation to Japan and then went into it like an Internet cafe, it would know that it was still meet because, uh, that's the systems are all interconnected. So I definitely thought that, um, the computer somewhere had gone. No logging from like the Romney was born cube first for her and that it recorded it as an error, like, three seconds later when she she had different mannerisms or whatever. And it swapped back. I thought that's what that scene was saying. So we can re watch it. Or we could just, like, find out at the end of the season, I guess. But, um, I'm definitely gonna disagree with the meanings that guess. And, uh, I have no idea who's right, because I don't remember that clearly either.
Over. I guess you just have to hurt. You just
have to re watch the cart. But actually, that doesn't fuck with my theory. It also concerned about it. Um, you're good, right? That was all yours. All right. Um, Michael,
Uh, yes. I don't really have any solid theories yet. I'm just curious to know how Maddux fits into all of it. And also seven of nine, I wonder how they're gonna bring her character in, Um, because I thought it looked like I thought it looked like, uh I mean, I guess Picard, who could go back to earth but looked like seven kind of was in his chateau or whatever, right when she came across to my thought, but, you know
watch. That's right. Sorry. Fuck. I'm sorry. No eso forget everything I just said No, I don't have any solid theories yet. I'm just excited to see what comes next.
Okay, So if you don't have any solid theories, what are the questions that are pressing on you the most? Aside from more seven
manly Maddox and what his role is in it, because, I mean hey, and data, he and data became friends towards the end of the show and everything. And so despite
their a traumatic beginning
Yeah, exactly. So And I'm just wondering, I don't think Matic sinless. He kind of went crazy. I don't think Maddox would wish any harm on synthetics or humans, for that matter. So I'm just curious as to what his deal is. Basically nice. D'oh.
Well, I will say,
And if no theories pressing questions
theories you have is that I think that something is gonna happen that's gonna cause Raffi and Picard to become close again. Um, just because, you know, it's just it's one of those things where she's starting out so broken,
is too. And you know, even though she's like, I'm coming with you. But I'm not with you. You're not. I mean, um, you drop me off a free cloud. I feel like something's gonna happen that's gonna redeem each other, you know, to each other. I mean, so yeah. Yeah, that's one thing I have And you know, she's broken, and we all love seeing people get fixed. You know what I mean? So, um, hopefully Picard could be that to her. I'm also, I think that considering we've never heard of the job cash until now and there's such this far back like entity, um,
I feel like there's we're
gonna learn something that I don't know, like I just there's gonna be more to it than just them being like a super secretive tal shi'ar. There's gonna be more to it since they're so empty. Aye, aye. They're so anti, um, android. And they're so anti. Yeah, like there's so much going on. But I think that there's even more to it in the in the sense that I feel like, um, it might even play into the ER. You know, the prophecy, right? How they might have a way like Maybe that that that ship that got assimilated, maybe they were Java. Sure, Maybe she was Josh like, there's there's so much there that we don't know cause they've literally never been brought up. So I'm just very excited. My theory is that the job Bosch are somehow gonna be ableto have some kind of connection to that prophecy and that that prophecy is because of the job. Bosch, because of, um,
or the sad vash exist exactly exactly the problem.
Yes. So there's something time. Those two together. I'm just not sure what it is yet.
I definitely agree. Ah, yeah,
and that's it.
Um, because you said that then my, uh my new theory is that Jack Bash because they've last so long. Every citizen previous episode, we'll be seeing them 1000 years and future show with a showdown with discovery. And also unfortunately, I hope you guys read. Watch Picard. I
do not know. How dare you, Keith going in case I'm not the one. I'm not your podcast. I'm not making a call. They're the ones that you had Their way will burn one
captain diving ridiculous way so they don't have to shoot very high
we're not talking about My generation's is not kissing, okay? You're back on the past. If
we want to talk about generations were doing it in its own episode that I could never
listen to again. OK, it's exactly my fury at least
anything else? Anything else? Thanks. We love you. Took it. Okay. You guys ready for my theory? It's long.
Okay. So you'll remember that my theory about episode one was that dollars was not really dead. Uh, yeah. Okay, here's my theory. Czar Vash are protecting us from Ah, a pair of twins That, like I said earlier, is kind of like similar to that Indian mythology where you have one that creates and one that destroys. So she seems to be the only twin that we have left because they seem to have killed Dutch. My theory is socially in Dodge Are the twins from the Rommel in history? Way back when that those odd Vasher trying to protect the world from So she's the good twin dodges the evil twin Dodge will come back and turn dark.
I hope you're right.
And data is actually not their parents. Madox, listen, listen, listen, listen Listen, listen. I'm super excited about the Syrian. I really hope it's right. Madox lied about data. The reason that data worked is because he used a piece of socially or dodge to create data in the way that episode one said that you needed a piece of data to create Androids the way that he was. Maddux tried to make data perfect, and he failed. Hence before never being. It's before it.
You talked about before? Never. Bean. It is data,
Yeah, you're so right I'm talking
about Okay, wait a minute now. Yeah, This is making more sense. Including totally
fucked that upset. Okay, so Maddox doesn't know Noone's saying light about data. Yeah, he tried to create data, and he fucked up with, Ah, the other ones. And then he found out about the twins having to have twins. Hence data and lower. Because of soju and Dodge, he used a piece of social and dodge to create data and lower. Maybe so she's lures like Pro TEM quote mother, and then dodges Data's or vice versa. So that's why I have no Lauren Data Data's good Lord Eve old. And
so she and
Josh are good and evil. Um, so we're gonna go to Maddox's figure out that lie. So that's my theory. Does in some dodgy in soc or the originators data was created from them. We don't know that. And the cash were trying to protect us from whatever world ending weird shed Dodge is going to do.
That is so awesome. It'll
never happen. Shut the good way. Extended like this. Ah, good God.
I hope you're right. But that's
too good. I really just want
the I just I really want the I guess that up after episode three points. Okay,
well, things would make sense
that if you think that's what
Okay, so that's my theory, because yeah. Um, and for those of you listening, we are now on pop cakes so you can find us some poppies. The great thing about Pop Gates is that it gives us a comments section so you can finally tell us how wrong you think we are or how right we think you are. And I would love to hear your theories too. Please just compliment mine.
Yeah, And when I put on my wall, if guys were listening this from a while, Please, let's know anything in the podcast. It's one to talk Star Trek with friends and fans
Zone you guys. I'm exploding with the need to talk to people about the card that will not insult me for whatever decision I make. You know,
just like that, Yeah, if you're one of those
people online who are like other people don't like the card because of this or like a card because of this. And I think that's a stupid reason and they're wrong. Chill out, man. Be nice to your neighbors. Start to teach you that we're great because we're We all have different opinions, and that's how you create great television, great storytelling. And I love you. Well,
that's a That's a great conversation because if we all think the same way there feel the same that it's boring. If if we don't have different opinions and different, you know, just just different ways of viewing life, then it's boring. So I mean no like, please, I want me not to agree with us. I want people to, you know,
like, tell me
if the four of us had agreed on everything this episode would not be twice as long as the actual upside. We watched
one anyway. So that's my theory. Um, last That's
a real quick, fun fact. I I saw this online, but that was pretty cool. The guy that plays f ate at the android. You know, that kind of kills Mars
this year. Christmas was
still Sabrina. Do you remember how Mac cosmetics had that booth in the Star Trek?
Okay, Vegas, 1550th
anniversary. Mac came out with a Star Trek, um, makeup line, which, actually, Jay, that Christmas. One of my friends but me, some of those because she was like you, like, start drinking like makeup. Here you go, eh? So I have some of those, um ed the Star Trek 50th anniversary L A convention in Las Vegas convention, which is actually Jane. I met. Um, Mac had huge display in the hired An
actor that basically did the data makeup is the guy that plays FAA. Yeah. Yeah. So he actually was at the Star Trek convention in Vegas on stage, getting data makeup put on. And now he he has turned into like that. He is a fool.
I mean, wait
I just thought I saw that on mine. It was like, That is just the coolest thing. Yeah,
when I go through the Easter egg hunts like it does show like there's a there's a few, like going back to stars all time. Like there was just so much anger that no one who is doing it understood how the world worked, or like how things fit in the world, or or how to use proper references so they make sense. But here, like VV, the opening theme for Picard is like the thing that the song he learned in that one of you is trapped inside that
in her life for a lifetime of any show.
One of the best episode. Yeah,
in the history of way we get from
there, we get that in the opening theme that,
Yeah, it's Carrie.
Yeah, I obviously I disagree with some of the decisions that have been made by the writing team, but it's very clear that they actually care about Star Trek and hard. And, um, that's absolutely yeah, more of people working on projects that they love. Um, I prefer writing teams and supposed to individuals because sometimes with individuals. You end up with something that's a little more just like fan fiction. Ah, Star Trek doesn't have that problem right now. I've only had that issue with stores so far, but, uh, great love from the writers and word. All right, so I guess that's all from us today. Uh, if you're listening. Thank you so much. You can find the rest of the episodes at www dot There are phone for stop. Come
on. You can? Yeah. I totally must pronounce that four horses. We're the horse. All right. There are folklorists dot com I can't honor for you. And also find it.
You can also find us on Twitter at four hosts. That's the number for that time. Um, most of those tweets are Michael. I think some of them are J. I haven't
They're on their own. Yeah, okay. I'm around. Responsive for all them. Unfortunately, sorry.
apologize in advance.
Now, the only offensive thing you've ever posted was on Facebook. So
we'll talk about that later. Another podcast? That's another. That's another show
for our listeners. He just made a post. That was like, ha. If you don't like Star Trek, the card. You're a jerk. And I was like, how dare you? But
I posted that. I was, like, wait to hear from supreme in 321 you know,
But it was a good fund. Like, um, Michael, I don't think you would ever be the kind of person to be like You disagree with my opinion while you're wrong and stupid. I I'm not offended. Good. Even if I said I am offended. Yeah,
that was early Star Wars discussion.
If you want to talk about toxic fandom, we can do it another time. All right, so once again, there are four host dot com. You can find us at four hosts on Twitter, and, um, e m not sure exactly what the link is, but you can find us on pop geeks again. That's the one that's gonna have the comment section. So if you want to tell us how wrong or how right or how much you disagree or agree with us, do it there. I'm gonna look in the comments because I can't shut up about Star Trek. So I will see you there. The very least, I'm guessing Mike, would you'll see Michael there because um you're so active on the Twitter and Ah, Jane, Keith, I assume
Yep. We'll be upon their Yeah, uh,
hit us up there, and, uh thanks. Everyone will see you next week.
Thanks, Spy and keep looking up.