There Are Four Hosts! (A Star Trek Picard Podcast)

Episode - 05 (Maps & Legends)

February 01, 2020 A Star Trek Picard Podcast Season 1 Episode 5
There Are Four Hosts! (A Star Trek Picard Podcast)
Episode - 05 (Maps & Legends)
Show Notes Transcript

Episode 2 of Picard is here and boy what an episode! Join the three hosts, with guest host Matt as we discuss "Maps & Legends". Will Picard get a ship for his secret 'save the world' mission? Will he have to be demoted to Captain to make it happen? Will Picard learn how to make a proper cup of tea? Tune in as we discuss those and more pressing questions from the latest Picard episode!

Support the show

spk_0:   0:17
All right. Thank you for tuning in. This is another episode of therefore hosts. My name is Michael. You can find me at Blue Beetle games.

spk_2:   0:26
My name's Sabrina. You confined me of what cat gave me on Twitter, Instagram and twitch.

spk_3:   0:32
My name is Keith. You confine me on Twitter at keep Hayward.

spk_1:   0:37
Hey, guys, this is Matt. You can find me on Twitter. And Instagram is Doc Falconer.

spk_0:   0:44
All right, So, Isa, buddy ready to talk about maps and legends? This is the second episode of Star Trek Picard. Um, I know talking to some of you guys a little bit before you had some not so great feelings about it, but, uh, my general overtaken the episode was I'm gonna I'm gonna play the J here and say that I loved it. I thought it was awesome. I love the story line. I love where they're going with it because I love the whole synthetic, eh? I, um you know, I just I love that's type of story lines, so I thought it was pretty good. That's my overall take. Um you know what, Sabrina? What was your overall take before we get into the details?

spk_2:   1:24
Well, I kind of wanted to talk specifically. Well, the head hacking, I bet. Now, um e I have very, very takes about different parts of episodes in different parts of the things I'm gonna say, very mixed. But right now, I'm not terribly happy. Okay. Yeah. Uh, what do you think, kids?

spk_3:   1:43
Um, I am also, unfortunately, never happy. And I'm actually I'm trying to fight against my unhappiness, so I can't tell like how much I'm trying to force myself to like it. And how much Maybe I'm laying, like, how much I like how my science fiction is. There were certain way, like my science fiction. So I can't tell. Like if I'm not just in myself to what they're trying to do enough like the frustrations I feel this are similar to what I got from the expanse where,

spk_2:   2:11
like yeah, same. Same. Sometimes I'm like, Okay, Am I being too unforgiving? Because actually, like original Star Trek is not as perfect as we pretend it is. And it has a lot of, like, dorky stuff in it, too. Is it just me, But sometimes I feel like I'm trying to force myself to like it. Yeah,

spk_3:   2:27
Yeah, um, that's what it's like in the expanse. Like it just seems like a coming, new accepted format of doing fiction where not a lot happens per episode. So if you sit down and say So what happened? This episode, you don't really get There's not much to get excited about to me versus me being late to bias where I've been watching it, coupled with Star Gate, where, like, every seven minutes, there's a chunk of Oh, my God, that happened. Oh, my God. They figure it that way. And then you get exciting. It's satisfying upend. But now we're not getting enough of a contained episodes. So that's my

spk_2:   3:04
pig. Really? I thought a lot happened this upset.

spk_3:   3:08

spk_2:   3:11
well, there were a lot of reveals. Okay, we'll talk about this a

spk_1:   3:13
minute. Do you think, um, I was a little bored? Honestly.

spk_0:   3:18
All right, hang on. We're stopping this whole pockets. No, I'm saying I

spk_1:   3:23
did. I break It didn't weigh

spk_2:   3:24
Need J. This is why we need

spk_0:   3:26
J. Come back, please. Mike,

spk_3:   3:28
I want to hear more of what you like, but you can bet,

spk_1:   3:30
huh? Yeah, I know. There was definitely aspects of it. that I liked about it has found my attention wavering a little bit. But at the same time, despite the fact that I was a little bit on the board side, I didn't dislike it. It just felt like a lot of things were kind of getting set up in this place, setting a lot of place setting. And so I you know, I appreciate the episode for that, and I think we're gonna see a lot of payoff, you know, hopefully in in subsequent episodes.

spk_0:   4:00
Um, well, I mean, I can I can speak briefly to what I liked, and then we can go toe. I really want to find out what Sabrina and Keith you guys didn't like about it. Um, I don't know. I Maybe I'm too easy on Star Trek, but, um, maybe I disagree. Maybe I miss you. Enjoy

spk_3:   4:16
how you enjoy it. What's that? Sorry. So I say, uh, you never need to apologize. You like it, how you like it. And that's your easy as you want to be, So it's totally cool. I want your your point of view.

spk_0:   4:26
All right. Like that. Keep. That's very I like that. Okay. Yes. Oh, I know I like. Like I said, the whole Aye. Aye, the don't know. It just It was a good episode. I liked, um I liked where they were setting things up, and I didn't need them to answer everything right. Then, um I think for the second episode, it was it was really interesting. I like the whole Borg. You know, Q. Being basically, like this artifact of this research station that they're going to, um, you know, I'm I want to know more about the SAT bash. You know why they have this hatred for all synthetic life? It just That was really interesting to me. Um, I don't know. It's I just thought it was a solid episode. I What? What What was that you guys didn't like? I mean, I'm not that I fall to four, and I just wondered What what about it? You know, you didn't care for

spk_2:   5:15
case. Would you like to go first on this one?

spk_3:   5:17
Sure. Um so there's ah thing that me, we're friends called doing it just to be doing it and actually races it, But yeah, it's Ah, there's like that. The Zach Bosch people. There's the Androids and whatnot, but yeah, it's too much place setting without any payoff at all. This episode where I can't tell, like if they can pay this off, You know, if if they can hit that last episode or maybe an episode or two in the future where I go Oh, my God, it changes. Why? I just saw It makes a cooler than Yes. But right now, all I got to see was like the android attack, which very new happened in, um, telling the card. Go home. And he went home. Then he just check out the space. And I'm not getting a lot of, um and I don't like a feeling I saw much by typewriting by the in the episode. Okay, Uh, Serena, what about you? Well, I

spk_2:   6:18
had, like, some specifics that kind of bother me, But first, I gotta just kind of laugh about the T and G convention of, like, the evil. And it's it's cute because they've combined evil Admiral team and Rami Lynn spy tm here. Um um but here's the thing that bothered me mystery or lack thereof. Okay, So, um, he goes to meet the first Admiral. Um, I don't really want to talk about that scene, but it was very aggressive. Um,

spk_3:   6:48
she's a crappy admiral like tradition,

spk_2:   6:50
right? She goes to the other admiral who was also a crappy animal in a different way. This one's actually evil. Rather than just mean to Picard are our beloved Picard. Um and ah. Then she's like, Oh, nothing's happening here. And it was like, Okay, this this will be an interesting mystery subplot that will see, like, she evil. In which way is she? Evil is she? Is she Section 31? Is she secretly, uh, Ramelan? And then immediately they reveal Oh, yes, Jews. Evil. In fact, it was like, OK, well, you killed that mystery. Okay, Well,

spk_3:   7:24
in that scene, she's glaring at the camera, just as evil person. Like she always looks suspicious.

spk_2:   7:33
Yeah, for real. And then, um, the human. Okay, what about the lieutenant? And then they immediately reveal that mystery. And then they're like, Oh, by the way, she's sisters with this other dude who is definitely with her because he's trying to get information from arms. Like you've just ruined five different mysteries. I was really gonna enjoy the development of these and now you've revealed all of them

spk_0:   7:53
well, but maybe there's a bigger Maybe there's bigger mysteries that they're gonna do later. Or does this

spk_2:   8:00
buildup Thio okay, Like information

spk_3:   8:05
to be Devil's advocate. And, like, I agree with you. But I was, like, second. But are we being too hard? It like we would we be mad if we didn't get anything like they gave us some information this episode? I guess so. That's cool, right? You

spk_2:   8:17
feel like it's being fed to me rather than let me figure it out. And I expect t and G. I expect to U S and T and G to treat me like an intelligent person

spk_3:   8:27
him way also, uh,

spk_2:   8:30
maybe I'm being too rough on it.

spk_3:   8:33
Woody, Uh, What's here? Do you do fall on Maur and liking or disliking?

spk_1:   8:38
Um I mean, I think a little bit more towards liking. Um, I'm pretty. I'm pretty easy as far as these things are concerned. Um but I will say, like, evil. Evil admiral won an evil admiral too. Um, when? When? When One called, too. I mean, two is immediately look so guilty. Yeah, like you, doesn't it to e

spk_0:   9:09
have my notice because she looked more suspicious. Eyes shifting, Have evil. Crappy

spk_3:   9:17
Admiral. One is a tradition of admirals in Star Trek, but she's not people

spk_2:   9:23
crap. Okay, that being said, though, I got to say, the actress that plays evil Vulcan, Enroll or evil, Rommel and Admiral maybe secretly, but I don't think so anymore because of what the other girl said. But, um, the actress that plays air Temelin Tomita she's in Stargate as to, uh, she's in Stargate Atlantis. Um, she's in Erica. She's really wonderful. I'm so glad she's getting to be like in another Star Trek franchise, even though I find her character. We've written kind of flat so far. Um, I love her, and I think she's gonna do a really great job. And while I'm talking about acting the pair with the card, the two, I guess they used to be tall. She our agents, which eyes one of the things that I really liked about it also really just cool Everybody who's like, why she Welsh, Chill out, dude, it is

spk_1:   10:13
Oh, yeah, I mean, I I was making, like, specific notes about those two. They're they're like some of my favorite parts of both of the first to have and I think, or

spk_2:   10:22
the balance each other.

spk_1:   10:24
Really? Really good, I think Orla Brady, um as ah is Loris. It's just so good, You know, I decided to love everything. Yeah, and then, yeah, I noticed. Like she's, um you said she's No, she's from she's Irish, Right? Is that Ah e think Well, uh, yeah. Eso es. But yet that accent, you know, it was just like a one point. I was like, Yeah, is that a Is that Irish? Well, sure that Rommel in, but yeah, but not really. I really dig it.

spk_0:   10:51
It's a raw Mulan accent. Yeah. So,

spk_3:   10:55
um, I knew

spk_1:   10:56
she looked familiar.

spk_3:   10:57
And thank you for pointing this out. She's Keiko from Karate

spk_0:   11:00
Kid, too. And also, yeah, I love

spk_3:   11:03
her. And I'm like, I just saw her yet in Stargate SG one was like I saw it was like,

spk_1:   11:08
Who is that? I looked

spk_3:   11:09
her up and, like, Yeah, she's first us cried a kid, too, and then she's been a bunch of she'd been having five vanishing son. So yeah, good

spk_1:   11:18
to see

spk_3:   11:18
you're in action again. Absolutely.

spk_0:   11:20
You just blew my mind Key because I love the credit. Kids don't have to go back and watch that now it's our cool. Um, one theory I thought of maybe everybody saw this already, but I was thinking that maybe those at Bosch we're responsible for the synthetic attack on Mars.

spk_2:   11:35
Yeah. Yeah,

spk_0:   11:37
because especially it took me, you know, because they did it on first contact day. Meaning there'll be very little actual human or, like, you know, not non synthetic life damaged or killed or other. So I think that's their kind of behind it. But, um, I don't know what we're doing

spk_2:   11:55
to me. They were definitely hacked. Yeah.

spk_0:   11:57
Yeah. Um, but I just thought that was interesting. Um, we'll see. So

spk_3:   12:04
I think I'm all the stuff that we're the I'm not what the surface are not liking. I think it's easier to try a treat. This is Ah, it's own timeline in world because the problem that I run to you is like Star Trek nit picking. Where ah, sure, there's their sun went nova or a star went nova whatever and took out their main planet. But they have a vast, um, planetary empire so that they wouldn't go extinct if their main planet went away. And if I was being that frickin big dork,

spk_2:   12:38
the main system, you mean that the whole star system? But

spk_3:   12:41
yeah. Yeah. So, like, if I let that go because I'm doing it for Stargate. Because Stargate kind of goes too far with just having entire Galaxies be hit. By which, you know, if I care about astronomy there, then I sweetheart of them too. So I guess for this you have to start adjusting how you think of Star Trek? Yeah,

spk_2:   13:03
I'm working on it, working on it. Okay, But I do have a question.

spk_0:   13:07
Sorry. Go ahead.

spk_2:   13:09
No, it's gonna be a long answer, so you can start.

spk_0:   13:11
I was gonna say, Do you think for you guys that didn't like it as much? Do you think it'll kind all depend on this third episode? And what they do with that for we're gonna wait for the you know, till the end.

spk_2:   13:22
It doesn't matter. I'm gonna watch the whole season. You're gonna stop me watching Star Trek. I'm just gonna complain about, um I'm really hoping that once Picard gets on the ship and he gets his gang together, that Ah, the story improves also because they're gonna stop doing so much like plot set up. So I'm not that concerned about it. Listen, like, no matter what happens is still gonna be something close to me. So, um ah, it's fine.

spk_3:   13:51
I have a bad feeling about this. So, like, um, I've been going I drink through fiction ever since. What happened to Star Wars like? Blew my mind. I was like, What happened here? Why isn't this is good Writing is like, you know, I used experience the eighties or Pope books or even cartoons that I watch. So what I'm trying to figure out it's been like a kind of mistreatment trampy out like, what's going on fiction. And I think it has. I'm gonna be a snob and say that I don't think the ability to pull this off because right now we have, like, a crop of lesser writers. And things have changed because I think as I keep going further and further back in time with, like, fiction and watching like reading books or watching TV shows, I think what we saw back then was people who had way less distractions than anything else. to d'oh! So that, like when they made the science fiction, that was what they're focused on like a laser. And, like, they support their entire mind and soul into it. Man, have anything toe do else. Really? So you saw, like, kind of beautiful masterworks versus, like what we're seeing now, which is shorthand, like, you know, placing brands in places and that being the payoff said makes sense.

spk_2:   15:05
No, I'm gonna It's sort of like how, um, somebody said Picard orders like Earl Grey tea five times in the entirety of TNG. But there has become, like, a phantom reference. Now he does it at least once. Perhaps

spk_3:   15:22
I don't want to be too. Yeah, they're wearing

spk_2:   15:26
part of his brand.

spk_3:   15:27
Yeah, like, yeah. And Doctor who? And stuff in Star Wars. They're all way too aware of us versus making good fiction. That works. Yeah.

spk_2:   15:37
Yeah, the internet definitely changed the way we tell stories. And I think that's reflecting even in their television.

spk_1:   15:44
Get dizzy. And, um, Sabrina, I think that yeah, the bring up the Earl Grey thing. Um, I agree. A lot of things like that seemed very heavy handed. Ah, they're doing everything but turning to the camera and winking, Yeah,

spk_0:   16:00
yeah. I mean, I'm not gonna apologize. Like he said, it's, you know, I should like it how I like it. But how you are. I mean, quite honestly. I mean, I love cards so much if he turned and winked at me, I'd probably like

spk_1:   16:11
i e o days lounge

spk_2:   16:16
there, depending on that. Which is why I think it's very important for everybody in the Phantom. Just Thio, you know, in any phantom in the world of general, whatever to recognize that we all have different things that we like and don't like. There's no way to make all of us happy because we all have totally different expectations. Um, I I feel that the world is saturated with meta references, so when I see them, they tend to annoy me. But that's not the case with most people.

spk_0:   16:44
Yeah, well, I like I I strongly disagree with you guys about just liking it, but But I respect your opinion. I respect your opinion on it. So that's you know, that's why you just gotta remember. Yeah,

spk_3:   16:54
I cheerfully I cheer you for your opinion. I am glad that you I'm I want to enjoy

spk_2:   16:59
it. Yeah,

spk_0:   17:01
because I was so worried it was gonna suck. And so I'm just happy that it's not crap.

spk_2:   17:05
You know, speaking of not sucking and something I was really worried about and that I think they shone really well in in that I I don't think discovered did that. Well, you have no idea what I'm gonna say.

spk_0:   17:18
No, no, With his name, the opening

spk_2:   17:23
thing is great. Yeah, My issue with Discovery was that they started with the TI West theme and then went into their own. And I was like, Ah, you're stealing a little too much there. They didn't do the thing that enterprise did that people were worried about putting. They went back to, like, our nice, classic like orchestra ll theme. And it's beautiful. I am. I ask all of you when you watch Episode three to just, like, take your time, put your get your tea ready before you start the episode. Just sit down, let the sound wash over you Look at that weird eye space. It's great. The theme is a minute. I just wanted to bring it up.

spk_0:   17:59
No, it's great. Um, speaking of discovery, did you guys? Uh, sorry. Did you guys find that by this point you were, like, in discovery? Um, more than your liking. The card.

spk_2:   18:12
Oh, no. I

spk_3:   18:13
mean, like, I like discovery more back. Like I will stand by my will stay except a bat and standby season One of discovery, mostly. Well, I think more than you know. I like to board and disliked it. Where were you doing? Discovery.

spk_0:   18:27
By the second the second episode of Discovery Season One. Were you more on board than you are with a card, you know? Yes. What are you gonna be? Mad

spk_2:   18:37
I discover was difficult for me from the beginning, So Okay. No,

spk_1:   18:44
I have been a bad nerd, and I have not seen any discovery. Um, yeah, I know, but, um, now that I have, ah, CBS all access. Thanks to Picard, I'm actually going to start watching it. Um, yes. Um, I'm looking forward to seeing what's going on. I was actually at a panel for discovery at Comic con, and it kind of got me excited for it. Yeah, So, um, looking forward to seeing what's going on there. But

spk_2:   19:15
Michael, how did you feel

spk_0:   19:18
I did not like it as much as I like to Picard, Definitely. I'm still a fan of discovery, but, uh, to me, to me, discovery it was just a means to get to Picard. Now that I've seen the card and like it so much, I'm still gonna watch Discovery. But to me, it's I guess I just missed. Not that Picard is like the old TNG. But I missed those kind of feels that I got, um so I That's why I like the card much more just cause I nostalgia feeling

spk_2:   19:49
I do feel that stepping away from the ensemble and discovery was a word choice.

spk_3:   19:53
Yeah, yeah, yeah. Um, for me, Discovery did a better job of establishing the world how the world worked in, like, potential stakes so that I was having more fun. And also seeing this that this is like before Kirk So people were dying on a lot because they are very imperfecta and kind of like some are jerks to each other, making bad calls. But since it's before Kirk and way before T and G, uh, to me, this is like still start free fleet growing into itself and a problem that people are having with ah Picard and, uh, discovered a little bit. Is that the act too much like us? Yeah, they act too much like us. And, like, what was cool about, um, t and G To me, it was like, this is how humans end up acting. So like, who we are right now and how we act right now aren't how we were in, like, the main consent. It's like you're seeing different from, So we want to see, like, when comes my science fiction? I want to see your different society, and they're really marrying Fox News and us too much.

spk_2:   21:01
Yeah. Um, but actually, I do have to give a point to Picard. So, um, Episode one there was, like, the violence in Dodges apartment, and then the explosion and, ah, I was like, That's weird. That should be on the news because violence isn't supposed to be happening much in utopia, you know, like, it should be a big recognizable thing. But I don't want to bring it up because we haven't seen the response to the explosion yet. In Episode two and then an episode two, they were like it was super scrubbed. It was hyper covered. All evidence of it is gone. And I was like, All right, all right, all right. You did it.

spk_1:   21:35
You know, um,

spk_3:   21:38
there's a quickly to that, um That, um my coincidence I saw is that I can't want to roll my eyes at it cause I was like, Mmm. Hi, guys. Doing some magic hand waving that you can make that too easy. But then they mentioned something about anti leaped ons. Like what? A spam e word. And then in Stargate, that weird. That day I was watching. They detected traces of lepton size like, Oh, what and left Toms do allow them to, like, slip out of, like, a dimensional visual record. I'm trying to get Thio. Yeah, but the left owns air like an actual science thingy that they actually used it. Alright, I

spk_2:   22:19
guess you just did

spk_3:   22:19
try so cool.

spk_2:   22:20
Yeah, I, uh the scene where he's with, um uh I gotta learn their names. Ramya, Lynley. And they're like checking her apartment to see if there's, like, flashback or whatever when they were using the particles to see where the girl was before. I really do this, Detective level there was with them.

spk_3:   22:42
The first thing the popular mind is like, How does guy zero in on that exact moment? Like what if they have been naked? You don't think it's a good thing you got right there and nothing else is happening

spk_0:   22:54
that beyond Cinemax,

spk_2:   22:59
can I just like to say a couple things absolutely well called it that his sickness like before was I upset when I called it that they would bring up his sickness from the end of T and G?

spk_3:   23:10
Yeah, dramatic syndrome.

spk_2:   23:11
I think it's it's too bad that it seems that they're just gonna use it. Rather, I think. Okay, um, it gives people a reason to disbelieve them and to be like, Is that really are you hallucinating? But I think it would have been cooler if they had used a narratively and not told us if it was really or if he was still his name for the first couple episodes, so we could be there and question it with them. But it's fine. There's a lot going on. Um uh, Picard makes tea like a savage. There's more

spk_3:   23:42
than one way to make

spk_2:   23:43
team. No, listen. Okay, so people are gonna joke about like, Oh, he put cream in it. That's discussing. Forget all that. She comes over this house. He says, What kind of tea do you want? She says, Oh, great. He's like a high. I knew there was something I liked about you. And then he takes his tea bag, opens the teapot and then just dunks it in a couple of times. No, no, no, no, no, don't do that. That's not how you make tea. Yep. So you pour the wine for that, Okay?

spk_3:   24:08
I've been doing it wrong all this time. I am so sorry. It's

spk_2:   24:11
one thing to do in a tea cup, because it's like small. But if you're doing a whole teapot, you're just not gonna

spk_1:   24:16
t e I I didn't even notice that it was one tea bag for the entire pot. Listen, that's not Yeah. Wow.

spk_2:   24:25
T is the thing. I pay attention.

spk_1:   24:27
Oh, I mean, that's what makes you like, right. No, I I'm not disagreeing like I did not even notice that, but yeah, that's gonna be That's gonna be some weak tea, no doubt about it.

spk_3:   24:36
Maybe it's because, like, he's been through to me life and death situations and seem

spk_1:   24:40
like a out

spk_3:   24:41
of yourself. Correct. He's like, you know what? Some

spk_0:   24:43
things don't matter.

spk_2:   24:44
Maybe he's just used thio thing, Uh, his, uh, like, generator. I'm forgetting.

spk_1:   24:50
Oh, yeah. Used

spk_2:   24:52
to ordering it from the computer.

spk_1:   24:55
Or maybe it's

spk_3:   24:56
like by his time, period. Like, you know, it's usually just done my comm period. He

spk_1:   25:00
doesn't or or its future t. And it's super strong, and he only needs one bag.

spk_0:   25:05
There you go. I like that. We'll do it. We'll do another podcast. We deep dive into the cards. T hat. Okay.

spk_2:   25:13
Okay. Um and then, um I'm curious if the human Rommie, let's buy the lieutenant knows, Uh, if dosh if she kidnapped Dodge. This is just a theory, okay? That the Romulans by kidnap Dodge because they scrubbed the explosion. So they knew was there if she could not dodge. And she knows where she is. Um And then he was the question that I wanted to post to you earlier. Um, the reclamation speed project. It isn't being run by Rami Lind, and if so, why are so many federation species on board? Are the federation in the Roman and connected. Now, what do you think?

spk_0:   25:53
That's why I was so I was wondering, like, you know, everything that the Romans do is supposed to be, like, top secret And what, you know. What are they? What's the purpose of the whole project? Because, I mean, I don't think they would have. You know, at least the Romney wins in the past that we've known would not have outsiders that weren't Ramya linen. They're researching the Borg. Oh,

spk_2:   26:12
like Kandorians.

spk_0:   26:13
Yeah. And trail and stuff. Because they could get advantages from stuff that they learn there. You know, I guess I don't know what the heck is going on. Um, it makes me wanna watch more, but I just I'm not sure. Yeah, I'm not sure what's going on. It's just seems weird to me.

spk_2:   26:28
Yeah. Do you go? 70 theories, Keith.

spk_3:   26:31
Ah, see, I am. So why guys talking? I was thinking maybe it's because they are from the Iran deal and start empire. That may consist of, like, you know, species they've overrun. But you're saying the endurance were there? Yeah, that's federation. So yeah, this is a good mystery. I'm not sure why we have so many different people there and what they're doing. And we also did see that they did have Borg on that ship. So that's pretty interesting. Like that living ones, but one's taken take

spk_2:   27:02
a, uh yeah. Speaking of which Oh, I'm sorry, did you have any thoughts?

spk_1:   27:08
But, um I mean, really pretty much just echoing what y'all were saying. Um, you really wasn't explained, but it yet it seems to be like some kind of cooperation thing going on. But you definitely get the impression that the Romulans are running the show. Yeah,

spk_0:   27:23
it has been 5843 days without yes, So

spk_1:   27:27
Yep. Oh, man, I made a note of that as soon as I saw it. Michael, we're going to see an accident waiting

spk_0:   27:35
room. Make sure this badge we put in the story for you doesn't turn off your phone wink at the camera.

spk_1:   27:42
Right? It's like check off days without incidents on

spk_3:   27:47
person, like looks over the shoulder at the camera, like

spk_1:   27:49
here we go. I feel

spk_2:   27:50
like like a a new version of Chekhov's gun. You know, why would you put that that sign in there if you're not gonna have an incident?

spk_1:   27:56
Absolutely. And then and then by the end of the episode, there's no incident like, Okay, next episode we better see incident.

spk_2:   28:06
Hey, maybe a useful way to track time to

spk_3:   28:08
you go. So I see too much of the branding to in this, and it's just like, uh, yes. So we get specifically CVS branded Tashi are very have Chelsea are and limit, like, specifically oriented toward Androids. That made me kind of stroke, which in a little bit. But I once again, I think I mean too hard on it and not give him a chance to pacing

spk_2:   28:34
Chris within the secret within

spk_3:   28:36
Yeah. Secret. Yeah, Chelsea are cool, but what's cooler is

spk_0:   28:41
I agree. If you keep this up, being too hard on it. Okay?

spk_2:   28:46
Okay. Okay. But let's make a game out of it instead. Um uh, and I'm gonna start with Met Matt. You're gonna have to go first this time. Okay? What is your theory about the secret? What's the big secret? Uh, the one that no one knows.

spk_1:   29:01
Yeah. Um, yeah, I I'm I don't know. I'm sorry. I got no theories in regard to the secret, but I mean besides, like, Okay, so we know that the Romulans hate synthetics. Um, that's that's fair. Um, and I get it. I get why they would Oh, you know, Um, so I know. But, I mean, like, I'm watching this. I'm sort of like, man, it sure looks like they're re purpose ing this Borg Cube for nefarious purposes. You know, there's just something about that. It just seems really sinister to me, and I don't think it's gonna end well, probably. Um,

spk_3:   29:42
just started this now, um, I know that they have been saying this while. So it's not too much this boiler that could connect to Discovery somehow. And now we have an organization that can last for thousands of years and discover is gonna be 1000 years in the future. Maybe they're time travelers or have information from the future that since will too much of a Terminator thing. I hope maybe they have not surveyed want induced or not, but information for the future. Let's this organization know that since are the main threat that they always need toe gun down through the

spk_2:   30:17
future threat. I like. Let's do it, Michael.

spk_0:   30:22
Uh, it's kind of kind with man. I have no fucking idea. But I love Keith's idea. Um, that maybe had the sense kind of take over. And so that's maybe that's the secret that the zat basher we're hiding. But you think if it was, you think they wouldn't keep it a secret so that they could get more people to join them to eliminate the synthetics? But, um, but that's

spk_2:   30:41
not the Rommie Lin wake.

spk_0:   30:42
That's that's true. That's true. So, yeah, they'd be like, Fuck it. We're not gonna tell anybody. No, I like that idea. No, um, so

spk_2:   30:50
good. Good, good. Thank you. More theories we have, the more likely we are to get one of thio for one of us to get it right? Right? Yeah. Okay. So, Keith, you're you're jumping ahead in the future, I'm gonna do the reverse. I'm gonna say Okay, so we had Ah, the Vulcans were unified, and then they were no longer. And the Romulans were like, Well, screw that. We're gonna leave. Maybe they were trying to bolster, like, how much work they could do. I don't know, but, um, early on, after the split, Rommie, Linds, decide to, you know, create an aye aye, to help them with creating a new world, and it goes very poorly. And then they crush it and then they're like, This will never happen again. So it's like, you know, all that certified, that we have, that we're afraid of the A a rebellion that But in the Romney live distant past, that's my theory. And so it's like ancient sect, making sure this never happens

spk_1:   31:37
again. Or

spk_3:   31:39
maybe maybe the Vulcans since

spk_2:   31:43
a I after the rum violence,

spk_3:   31:45
the raw Mulan's are Androids.

spk_0:   31:47
This entire like the reason

spk_3:   31:49
why they split off. And like you have this all these emotions and were different from the Vulcans were that their a I and the Vulcans don't talk about it. And then, like, you want to be the only a power in the galaxy

spk_2:   31:59
and perfect. The Robins are so secretive, secretive, because they're actually just all robots

spk_1:   32:06
way show. Yeah, nobody keeps a secret like a robot. That's what I always say, right?

spk_2:   32:16
So So you'll notice when I say that I have very many feelings that have very positive feelings and very negative feelings. But again, Alison Pill is adorable. I just need to throw that in, like, once. Perhaps it.

spk_0:   32:28
Oh, yeah, she is. Um, yes, you were. So what? Like what did you, Sabrina and Keith? What did you like about the episode? What was? Because I know you said whether you didn't, like, what did you like? And that we have to have Esmat too? Well, he I mean, he was kind of on my side, but we can definitely ask himto since you guys were the ones that didn't like it as much, I was wondering what you did like about it. Um, Sabrina? Huh? I think

spk_3:   32:53
we got some new ships. The got some new ships on the screen like that. I like a little progress on seeing, like the technology and how it works in the world. That's kind of fun. Um, I like, uh, car's performance. If I'm not exactly liking this version of Picard, Uh, I love seeing him onscreen. God bless this frickin heart. Even if it sucks. Like I'm still, like, just got hugging him while he's on the screen going. Just talk some more. See what? So that I like. But I have to say one thing I don't like, not toe. Um imbalance because I just got that way earlier. But, um, I don't need to see my heroes die on the screen. Well, yeah, I I liked seeing like them right off in the sunset and leave it to my imagination. What the ending is like so Luke Skywalker. Now, Picard, I just I don't need to see that ending happen on screen, but I think the actors loved doing it Seems to me nothing actors love more than being able to do their ultimate death sequence, which I wish they'd stop doing. But, you know, it's what they want.

spk_2:   33:59
I'm actually not that into it.

spk_0:   34:01
Good. So what did you What did you like?

spk_2:   34:07
Um, generally, my my my upset, sir, about, like, the over our king way that the plot is functioning, that the world was created. But like on an individual level, like, I like the music. I like a lot of the actress's performance. Not all of them, but, like, I don't I don't like all of the performances and, you know, like, sorry, cast. But like, I, I don't like all the performances in the other Star Trek shows. This that new like out of people there's one person that you might not like. Um, I super love the the chemistry between Picard and his Rommie Lind friends. And I'm gonna love it even more if it turns out they're secretly tell she are. Even though I'm like, I know some people are a little like, Come on. But I think, like, I don't know why they decided to be like servants. Kind of. But I like that. They'd just be like All right, well, screw this. We're gonna go live with card, whatever protective. It's cool. And I'm hoping that I'm really gonna like the chemistry, uh, on the ship. Um, just like, yeah, uh, bits of it are really great. I'm just not enjoying the plot overall, and, uh, that might get,

spk_0:   35:24
um, one other thing I made note of. I wanted to talk to guys about the when he was talking with the admiral. Mike. Remember her name, but in the office and they were talking about, like, the Federation Federation doesn't get to decide, you know, whether a species lives or dies, and she's like, Yes, we do. That kind of struck me as kind of kind of harsh and cold. It's like what? What do you guys think she meant about meant by that? Um, like, literally. Or because I took it, as you know, because they had all their ships doing the Rommie Lynn rescue. You know, they had to pull them back toe, defend off the synthetics. But, um, you know, I just thought that was kind of harsh for her to say that. I don't know what What did you guys think?

spk_1:   36:04
Um, I felt like that was kind of her way of saying we got to make the hard choices, you know, maybe not necessarily. Okay, Yeah, This these guys gotta go. Ah, but more like, Okay, we only have so many resource is, and we want to do the best for everybody we can. But sometimes that means that somebody's gonna miss out, and it's gonna be for the greater good, right? The You know, that old spot quote, he needs the many and all

spk_0:   36:27

spk_2:   36:30
that's actually my least favorite scene of the episode, because it felt like it was written specifically just to be like Ha ha. Look, the federation sorry. Starfleet is mean, and they won't help the card. And, uh, you should think of them as the enemy. Yeah, it felt really fun. She was, like, extra aggressive. You know,

spk_3:   36:49
I'm in the middle on that. Where, um I I agree. I would be idea of. She's an admiral and, like, I don't know how long Picard's being out of the game. But, you know, she has secret organizations within her own secret organizations. So she does know the crazy shit that card probably doesn't know. And she does have to make the horrific, terrible decisions that aren't the good ones. And unfortunately, she has to live through it while, you know, Picard gets to make some frickin wine all day. So he just walked up in my office here and, like, you know, I just had to tell someone their kid isn't coming home. Picard, I don't have time for this so I could see her being like that. But I also hate seeing Starfleet be assholes. But another thing that comes back to why there's been criticism of how Star Trek has progressed, where more and more people are being like dastardly and shifty and pickles of what we want him to be. And I remember a long time on T and G era like all the actors complain. I want to act. I don't get to act all weird and crazy. Don't do it. They just have to be mature every freaking episode. And they didn't like that. But it was Gene Roddenberry's vision inside six and future that, Hey, look, sometimes humanity can change grew up. So that's the kind of conflict we see here where, like, we want to see mature science fiction, the heroes, but the actors they want to do there, they don't have fun.

spk_2:   38:16
The the actors don't get to decide what the writers write, except for Card. So, um uh uh, I don't know if I would put too much weight on what the actors want to do, but, uh, definitely, Uh, yep, that's that's part of my struggles where I'm trying to, like, be forgiving, but also like that was the whole thing with the Roddenberry trek, you know, we're better now. All right, then why are we acting exactly the same? Um ah, I just got to say I'm gonna be very upset if the finale ends with, um, Starfleet was secretly the one that did the android thing. Just really upset Mo man. If that happens, I'm gonna, like, go under my desk. And, like,

spk_3:   38:58
I think it's 100% ambulance. Yeah, if the secret agent Robin is this gonna be 100%

spk_2:   39:04
the lieutenant and her brother who is sleeping with what's her face Stop sister.

spk_0:   39:08
Right, Which I mean, if he's part of those at Brash, and he hates synthetic life, and but I find it hard believe that he would be sleeping with one, you know? I mean,

spk_2:   39:16

spk_0:   39:17
that's it. So I'm wondering deep below sea really is, you know, fully stocked bar stories is kind, like on the fence or something. I don't know. It seemed weird to me that he would do that.

spk_2:   39:24
Yeah. I feel like on the fence is something that's gonna happen. Um, yeah, yeah. She will be afraid. She's expecting to be betrayed by the animal, and instead she gets betrayed. My own brother. Fun twist. Yeah, I'm okay with the raw Mulan's behaving like us because the Romans are not supposed to be, you know, perfect. Whatever. Um, Romans were not federation. They can be as weird and bazaars they want. Just like I don't expect the Frankie to be, like, nice so that they could do whatever they want. Yeah, that's the thing. So we have two plots. We have the Picard plot, which is, like the a utopian federation plot and then plot B, which is like that Borg ship. That's like the matzo. Oh, not so perfect. Awesome stuff. So I hope that the divide becomes strong, girl, I guess, if that makes sense, Yeah. I'm just upset that everything that we've seen of Starfleet is just that big jerks.

spk_1:   40:20
Yeah, Um, the first admiral. I mean, she even said, like, part of the reason I'm being mean to you is that you said being things about me and er on TV when you say those things now. No, I'm not gonna be nice to you. Yeah, I think that

spk_0:   40:38
even in that utopia, they're still gonna be jerks, right?

spk_2:   40:42
Yeah, but

spk_3:   40:45
different tricks. Not the same kind of tricks. Yeah. Perfect jerks. Perfect. A more intellectual means

spk_1:   40:52
being a jerk, and it's for a very good reason.

spk_2:   40:55
We call those bushier.

spk_0:   41:00
Um, I do, too, but I start. I watched that over again recently, and and as like, he was so aggressive towards Dax. You know, flirting is Oh,

spk_2:   41:09
my God,

spk_0:   41:09
It was wholly shed. Dude, what's going on?

spk_2:   41:12
I don't know. I don't know where the rating is. Seven assure should say this, but yeah, he's in the first couple seasons. He's a real fuck boy, but he getsem development kind of in that realm. Uh, he's not perfect at it, Certainly. But other parts of improved to the point where, like, it's not so much a problem. Yeah, it's definitely a problem in season one. You're so right.

spk_0:   41:31
Yeah, I mark this these as explicit. She can say whatever you want.

spk_2:   41:35
Oh, great. But he's a real

spk_3:   41:37
guy. Yeah, I have fun disliking characters. So, like, if a character sucks, it was a jerk in fiction. It's fun to me, Toe. Like, how interact with my fiction is kind of like inserting myself in there and the same like this fucking asshole, but that that's what you are in the show. And yeah,

spk_0:   41:55
So I've been seeing Bashir weakened

spk_2:   41:56
simultaneously, say stuff about him like that and be like, he's great. We love him.

spk_0:   42:01
Um, a couple of sorry. Go ahead.

spk_2:   42:05
I said you were saying

spk_0:   42:06
Oh, yeah, a couple of things I loved about the episode, and these were completely like fan service. But I loved when Picard was like, you know, I never cared for science fiction, you know? I just didn't get it. I get me near my eye. I know. But like I said before, I was like, he could turn to the camera and weaken me, and I'd be fine with it. So I shouldn't be surprised that I like that. Um, And of course, the music that they had when he put on the combat And when he arrived at Starfleet, You know, this little Star Trek theme was I thought was great. But again, I I'm into that fan service is stuff like Jay. That's funny. Those air. Exactly. Those

spk_1:   42:37
are two of the same exact things I wrote down for the things that I really enjoy. Um,

spk_0:   42:42
There you go. I know I like you, man.

spk_1:   42:44
They have I. Oh, I was plucking a visitor badge on. That was a nice little moment of humor to it was like the way he did it, you know, it was a sort of plunk, right? I get it. I see where I'm at now.

spk_2:   42:56
Oh, my God. Yeah, that was really funny to the kid who was who signed him. And I was like, What do you doing? Apologized, like a least. Be like, Oh, I'm sorry. I didn't recognize you, Admiral. Like, what you doing? Are you least, like, pretend to have some decorum when you realize it's an admiral? Like it doesn't even matter for Know his name?

spk_3:   43:16
Oh, you mean this guy who saved the entire universe

spk_1:   43:18
several times. Let me get your visitor badge for you, then. Yeah, he's doing all that while there's a hollow. I'm pretty sure of the 17. 01 d right above. Yeah.

spk_3:   43:34
Is the pike Enterprise from one of the d

spk_2:   43:39
D? Yeah,

spk_3:   43:40
you're right. The D is right above him. His ship supreme is the glowing above his head. He's like, Oh, yeah, you

spk_1:   43:47
know, there should be a

spk_2:   43:47
bit, though.

spk_0:   43:48
Yeah, it would be a from Is that the stuff from Discovery? Okay.

spk_2:   43:53
Yeah, it's the discovery. Um, I mean, because CBS already has the, you know, blueprints for it in their computer. It's a good one. Yeah. I don't have any complaints about that. Something else. I don't have any complaints about And actually, I haven't seen anybody mention. I mean, I've been kind of avoiding people talking about the show because I don't want to influence me too much before we record these. But I haven't seen anybody complain about the uniforms, and I have no complaints about. Well, they're, like, close enough to the other ones while still being fresh. I like the new visitor. Budge. I think the visual team did a great job.

spk_3:   44:29
Yeah. Yeah. Agreed. Agreed. A buddy of mine poster on my wall like wake. He mostly doesn't like it, but he's like those uniforms that I was like, right. I would wear the hell out of that.

spk_2:   44:41

spk_0:   44:43
All right. So what do you guys looking forward to? You know, with the next episode and the season in general. Um special. What's that spaceship?

spk_3:   44:53
I want to see the hero ship. Like

spk_0:   44:54
you told me. The hero ship has been two episodes.

spk_2:   44:56
Wanted the jury. Right. Where's your Ryan?

spk_3:   44:58
Yes. Oh, yeah, Yeah, yeah. Please do her right. Oh, yeah. Oh,

spk_1:   45:08
and, uh, Reicher, Of course. I want to see if he does the Rikers sit. You know, one like

spk_0:   45:14
Oh, yeah, yes,

spk_2:   45:16
of course.

spk_1:   45:16
I really hope that's, uh Yeah, that's a camera.

spk_0:   45:23
No, Um all right. Is there anything else you guys want to talk about specifically with the episode or in general life? What's going on?

spk_3:   45:33
Um, I guess I'm getting more and more niche to go back to my starship in Star Trek online. If you guys haven't played that like a few of Star Trek, this

spk_0:   45:42
is Star Trek. It's okay. All right. Uh, quickly. I have a thing. Question then, Keith, I've played that a little bit. Is there Is there like, a good tutorial? Because there's so much stuff going on in there, you know, Toe absorb, is there a good tutorial that you could recommend for? People are

spk_3:   45:58
nothing. No, because I also admit that I'm really bad at the game. OK, I'm only playing. Yeah, I only play it for the story, and I think the game is so easy. It's so easy on you that you can usually, like, almost go through any scenario without, like doing too much strategy or farming or what not? And it's more of just being able to say it's your captain on, like the Bridge of the Voyager as you hit some kind of anomaly. Like what's going on here, Tuvok? You like, Oh, my God. The regional voice Actors coming back. So

spk_0:   46:27
basically, just fake it for the Star Trek stuff.

spk_2:   46:30
Yeah, Yeah, I I used to play a video, and it is notoriously obscure. They never really explained to you how stuff works, but optimize your ships. Um, but I mean, like, if you want a shot of nostalgia, go play us to you. Um, you know, I haven't played for a while again, so maybe they change this. I really hope not. But Leonard Nimoy introduces every new area that you go into a MME. Some of the story lines are very close to or like, very connected to, like, specific episodes. Like, if you remember, there was that Denali thing in Voyager with Harry. He had, like, a girlfriend, and then she died. And then the Denali took her body. I think they're called the General Lee. There's a reference to that episode in one of the missions, like man,

spk_3:   47:24
that becomes like a galactic thing, even like the small references that you that everyone else has forgotten that you remember from the Star Trek they come back in big ways. Such as, like this, that this one star gate in like for season built by some empire that had long passed. Well, they come back and it's pretty freaking epic. And yeah, the source one behind started

spk_2:   47:46
online If you like,

spk_3:   47:47
You even get a bird of prey to go back in time once.

spk_2:   47:49
Oh, yeah. You can go back in time, like on the T. O s shape, if you like. Links to the camera. Go place Theo.

spk_0:   47:56
All right. You miss Tasha Yar. Well, what about that? But I don't like wings to the camera, so I'll give you. Um all right, was

spk_3:   48:04
the only thing they don't references.

spk_0:   48:05
Pulaski. Dammit! That's okay. I never liked her. Right. Uh, anything else you guys want to talk about with the corridor? The episode? Okay, um, I have some good news for everybody. Hopefully, our friend Jay may be coming back for the next episode or very soon, so we look forward to that. But I don't think Matt and all the other people that filled his, you know, spot while he was out. Um be sure to check out the website at therefore hosts dot com, and we're at Twitter at four hosts. And until then, we will see you guys next time long and

spk_3:   48:41
stuff and junk, right?